Question:

OMIDOG SO funny!!! Note to self: Read all of Jef.’s posts Kim

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

Oh good grief……too funny Thanks Jef. I needed that. Amy

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

LMAO! Meterless Mike

Response:

Oh.  My.  God.   Edna.  I have never in my life laughed so hard in one night in my life.  First Jef’s, now these weight watchers cards.  Oh I ache.

Me too.  Those cards were also hilarious… plus, I started Yoga instruction yesterday.  Can you say "ouch"?  My entire body is one big ache. hugs, achy elle — "Our biggest burden is also our greatest gift." — Anon

Response:

Thank you!  Thank you Edna!  I laughed so hard I cried ….at the WW cards. OMG…it felt sooo good!! Laughter truly is the best medicine!!!!     You and Jef have certainly provided the humor tonight!! Sweet dreams,   JoAnne

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yeah, I saw these via Metafilter a few days ago.  The first couple of dozen are laugh-till-your-throat-cramps funny, then they start to go downhill. Then they pick back up again.  You could spend your life going through these.  This is the funniest thing since the Gallery of Regrettable Food. (Have you seen the Weight Watchers recipes: http://www.poundy.com/wwcards.html ) Remember when I used to go through a bad patch in my quit and I would post a "Joke Alert"?  Joe Laughter, among others, would actually save up jokes for "joke alerts."  Nothing kills a craving like a great big belly laugh. epvof Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yeah, I saw these via Metafilter a few days ago.  The first couple of dozen are laugh-till-your-throat-cramps funny, then they start to go downhill. Then they pick back up again.  You could spend your life going through these.  This is the funniest thing since the Gallery of Regrettable Food. (Have you seen the Weight Watchers recipes: http://www.poundy.com/wwcards.html ) Remember when I used to go through a bad patch in my quit and I would post a "Joke Alert"?  Joe Laughter, among others, would actually save up jokes for "joke alerts."  Nothing kills a craving like a great big belly laugh. epvof Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Edna, your wwrecipe card site led me to this site: http://www.catesgarage.com/food/food.html where Greg (hubby) and I have been stuck for the last half hour (at least) laughing our asses off on the various pages at the site.  How hilarious!!! Thanks to you and Jef for the HUGE belly laughs we’ve enjoyed tonight at all three sites!  OMIDOG! I’m almost late for chat!!! ROFLMAO!!! ;^D *hugs* —    BinnieBee –  A Proud Old Fogie!        %%      (—-)     ( __< )     ^^ ~~ ^^     ~f3as3~ Quit since 11/01/2001 http://binniebee.com http://www.cyberdigs.com

Response:

A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

This one made me hurt. Thanks! I haven’t laughed like that in ages. It started slow, but by the mid point I had trouble finishing the sentences. Cheers, lance — I haven’t smoked for 4d7h15m. I’ve resisted smoking 107 cigarettes. This has saved me $44.94 CDN. I have gained 8h 55m of life.

Response:

Oh.  My.  God.   Edna.  I have never in my life laughed so hard in one night in my life.  First Jef’s, now these weight watchers cards.  Oh I ache. Thanks. Willene

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yeah, I saw these via Metafilter a few days ago.  The first couple of dozen are laugh-till-your-throat-cramps funny, then they start to go downhill. Then they pick back up again.  You could spend your life going through these.  This is the funniest thing since the Gallery of Regrettable Food. (Have you seen the Weight Watchers recipes: http://www.poundy.com/wwcards.html ) Remember when I used to go through a bad patch in my quit and I would post a "Joke Alert"?  Joe Laughter, among others, would actually save up jokes for "joke alerts."  Nothing kills a craving like a great big belly laugh. epvof Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

My god.  Tears are running down my face, my throat hurts from cramps, and I think if I stand up I’ll pee myself. Willene

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

Oops, sorry!  What you posted was like a "best of" compilation of what was linked at Metafilter, which was the following thread: http://board.crewcial.org/t.php?id=16330&r=300 Traffic on the site was so heavy after the thread was Metafiltered that the site is now requiring registration and a password.  Which is kind of a shame, because there were hundreds of posts giving joke captions to these U.S. Government icons for "in case of terrorist attack," and it was hysterical. epvof

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yeah, I saw these via Metafilter a few days ago.  The first couple of dozen are laugh-till-your-throat-cramps funny, then they start to go downhill. Then they pick back up again.  You could spend your life going through these.  This is the funniest thing since the Gallery of Regrettable Food. (Have you seen the Weight Watchers recipes: http://www.poundy.com/wwcards.html ) Remember when I used to go through a bad patch in my quit and I would post a "Joke Alert"?  Joe Laughter, among others, would actually save up jokes for "joke alerts."  Nothing kills a craving like a great big belly laugh. epvof Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

Good lord, Jef… those are so fucking funny I am aching from laughter hugs, elle — "Our biggest burden is also our greatest gift." — Anon

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee143 3/emergency.html

that is fucking priceless.

Response:

Funny????

Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

Yeah, I saw these via Metafilter a few days ago.  The first couple of dozen are laugh-till-your-throat-cramps funny, then they start to go downhill. Then they pick back up again.  You could spend your life going through these.  This is the funniest thing since the Gallery of Regrettable Food. (Have you seen the Weight Watchers recipes: http://www.poundy.com/wwcards.html ) Remember when I used to go through a bad patch in my quit and I would post a "Joke Alert"?  Joe Laughter, among others, would actually save up jokes for "joke alerts."  Nothing kills a craving like a great big belly laugh. epvof

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

Yeah, I saw these via Metafilter a few days ago.  The first couple of dozen are laugh-till-your-throat-cramps funny, then they start to go downhill. Then they pick back up again.  You could spend your life going through these.  This is the funniest thing since the Gallery of Regrettable Food. (Have you seen the Weight Watchers recipes: http://www.poundy.com/wwcards.html ) Remember when I used to go through a bad patch in my quit and I would post a "Joke Alert"?  Joe Laughter, among others, would actually save up jokes for "joke alerts."  Nothing kills a craving like a great big belly laugh. epvof

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

Oops, sorry!  What you posted was like a "best of" compilation of what was linked at Metafilter, which was the following thread: http://board.crewcial.org/t.php?id=16330&r=300 Traffic on the site was so heavy after the thread was Metafiltered that the site is now requiring registration and a password.  Which is kind of a shame, because there were hundreds of posts giving joke captions to these U.S. Government icons for "in case of terrorist attack," and it was hysterical. epvof

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yeah, I saw these via Metafilter a few days ago.  The first couple of dozen are laugh-till-your-throat-cramps funny, then they start to go downhill. Then they pick back up again.  You could spend your life going through these.  This is the funniest thing since the Gallery of Regrettable Food. (Have you seen the Weight Watchers recipes: http://www.poundy.com/wwcards.html ) Remember when I used to go through a bad patch in my quit and I would post a "Joke Alert"?  Joe Laughter, among others, would actually save up jokes for "joke alerts."  Nothing kills a craving like a great big belly laugh. epvof Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

Good lord, Jef… those are so fucking funny I am aching from laughter hugs, elle — "Our biggest burden is also our greatest gift." — Anon

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee143 3/emergency.html

that is fucking priceless.

Response:

Funny????

Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

My god.  Tears are running down my face, my throat hurts from cramps, and I think if I stand up I’ll pee myself. Willene

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

This one made me hurt. Thanks! I haven’t laughed like that in ages. It started slow, but by the mid point I had trouble finishing the sentences. Cheers, lance — I haven’t smoked for 4d7h15m. I’ve resisted smoking 107 cigarettes. This has saved me $44.94 CDN. I have gained 8h 55m of life.

Response:

Oh.  My.  God.   Edna.  I have never in my life laughed so hard in one night in my life.  First Jef’s, now these weight watchers cards.  Oh I ache. Thanks. Willene

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yeah, I saw these via Metafilter a few days ago.  The first couple of dozen are laugh-till-your-throat-cramps funny, then they start to go downhill. Then they pick back up again.  You could spend your life going through these.  This is the funniest thing since the Gallery of Regrettable Food. (Have you seen the Weight Watchers recipes: http://www.poundy.com/wwcards.html ) Remember when I used to go through a bad patch in my quit and I would post a "Joke Alert"?  Joe Laughter, among others, would actually save up jokes for "joke alerts."  Nothing kills a craving like a great big belly laugh. epvof Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yeah, I saw these via Metafilter a few days ago.  The first couple of dozen are laugh-till-your-throat-cramps funny, then they start to go downhill. Then they pick back up again.  You could spend your life going through these.  This is the funniest thing since the Gallery of Regrettable Food. (Have you seen the Weight Watchers recipes: http://www.poundy.com/wwcards.html ) Remember when I used to go through a bad patch in my quit and I would post a "Joke Alert"?  Joe Laughter, among others, would actually save up jokes for "joke alerts."  Nothing kills a craving like a great big belly laugh. epvof Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Edna, your wwrecipe card site led me to this site: http://www.catesgarage.com/food/food.html where Greg (hubby) and I have been stuck for the last half hour (at least) laughing our asses off on the various pages at the site.  How hilarious!!! Thanks to you and Jef for the HUGE belly laughs we’ve enjoyed tonight at all three sites!  OMIDOG! I’m almost late for chat!!! ROFLMAO!!! ;^D *hugs* —    BinnieBee –  A Proud Old Fogie!        %%      (—-)     ( __< )     ^^ ~~ ^^     ~f3as3~ Quit since 11/01/2001 http://binniebee.com http://www.cyberdigs.com

Response:

Oh.  My.  God.   Edna.  I have never in my life laughed so hard in one night in my life.  First Jef’s, now these weight watchers cards.  Oh I ache.

Me too.  Those cards were also hilarious… plus, I started Yoga instruction yesterday.  Can you say "ouch"?  My entire body is one big ache. hugs, achy elle — "Our biggest burden is also our greatest gift." — Anon

Response:

Thank you!  Thank you Edna!  I laughed so hard I cried ….at the WW cards. OMG…it felt sooo good!! Laughter truly is the best medicine!!!!     You and Jef have certainly provided the humor tonight!! Sweet dreams,   JoAnne

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yeah, I saw these via Metafilter a few days ago.  The first couple of dozen are laugh-till-your-throat-cramps funny, then they start to go downhill. Then they pick back up again.  You could spend your life going through these.  This is the funniest thing since the Gallery of Regrettable Food. (Have you seen the Weight Watchers recipes: http://www.poundy.com/wwcards.html ) Remember when I used to go through a bad patch in my quit and I would post a "Joke Alert"?  Joe Laughter, among others, would actually save up jokes for "joke alerts."  Nothing kills a craving like a great big belly laugh. epvof Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

LMAO! Meterless Mike

Response:

Oh good grief……too funny Thanks Jef. I needed that. Amy

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

OMIDOG SO funny!!! Note to self: Read all of Jef.’s posts Kim

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Humor has been a MAJOR factor in keeping me out of prison since I quit smoking. "Why is that?" you ask. Simple: If I couldn’t have at least one good belly laugh a day, I think I’d have long since killed someone out of sheer frustration. A pal forwarded this to me, and I have sat here for the last couple of minutes actually making loud, hooting noises as I read it. Politics be damned; this was just to funny NOT to pass along to you guys…. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/wlee1433/emergency.html

Response:

Question:

[Liz] How can you tell how far to stretch?? [an injured achilles tendon]  Is there some range of motion you’re aiming for?  Or what criteria do you use? [Gordon C.] Do not stretch until the pain is gone.  Stretching will exacerbate the problem.  If you do stretch, do so only when warm, and not too hard. [Liz] ???  ACK!!!  Gordon, I was told that if I didn’t stretch the thing, it would heal up all scarred and lose elasticity.  I don’t understand.  How do these pieces of information reconcile?  They say a "gentle" stretch. Whatever that is. [Ozzie G.] Again check out, http://www.mindfulness.com/of1.asp The tendons are not suppose to stretch.  They can but they’re not suppose to. [Liz] Did.  In fact when I arrived at the health club this evening I was pleased to discover they had a bar that looks exactly like the one in the picture for this article.  I spent a while rolling my calves on it as described. It would make perfect sense that, since the tendon-muscle seems to be all one piece, that if the calf muscle is at all tight it will pull the tendon too much, and that any solution to an achilles problem would have to involve stretching, relaxing, or perhaps lengthening the calf.  I I also had a friend massage my calves last night and they felt less tight afterwards.   But two questions remain. (Actually three – the 3rd one is, how can I get my friend to come massage them every night? My physical therapist and several running friends all insist emphatically that tendons must be moved while they heal. As they describe it, the new tendon tissue is laid down every which way, rather than in nice neat parallel lines like it was before it was hurt, and in order to keep this random tissue from becoming a permanent weakness of the tendon, you have to bend the ankle through some range of motion.   I think this is supposed to break up the scar tissue or perhaps prevent it from being laid down too short or in the wrong direction.  (If this is incorrect, please jump all over it – I’m new at this.)  People were emphatic that simply immobilizing the tendon and waiting would not produce proper healing. If true, then I gather there are two problems: 1. How to stretch the muscle, without at the same time pulling too hard on the injured tendon and aggravating it.  This accomplished by rolling and massage? 2. How to move and bend the ankle the right amount – the amount that will lead to best repair – without pulling it too far and aggravating it. This is what the stretching is supposed to do. Some people seemed to think you were unlikely to damage the tendon while stretching for this purpose; others thought you could and that it was important not to overdo it. The *only* concensus at all I’ve gotten on this question – how much and how far to bend the ankle – is that you shouldn’t feel pain in the tendon during the stretch. The jury is still out on whether any pain you feel later is OK or means bad things. (Bill see my next note.) Any comments? Thank you… Liz Liz Day Indianapolis, Indiana, USA

Response:

Stetching the calf seems to work best in my one experience with sore achilles.

How did you stretch it without pulling the achilles, or did you? You mentioned that after stretching the pain comes back later.  The calf muscle has probably cooled and tightened up again….

It definitely has, because I put ice on it.   Guess I should warm it back up. Before stretching, first extend the muscle against resistance by contracting it, with the weight on your toes for example.

Is this the eccentric contraction I have read about? Did you get any advice on why the achilles became sore in the first place?

Overuse, running too fast when I was tired and not paying attention. *sigh*   You have to discover your own limits with a conservative approach that does not cause further damage.  Not cut and dry.

YES!  The feedback from my body is the only clue I have.  I need to know what it’s telling me.  Am a bit frustrated with being told "stick with the program even though you don’t understand it" when am getting all kinds of pain signals and don’t know what they mean. Getting advice from a physical therapist as well as introduction to some stretching, stretching devices, methods and criteria for how much to stretch would be the best.

Got all the but last one – criteria for how much.   If you can, warm up the body first.  At least begin with warm temperatures.  Start very slowly, flexing the ankle, knee, toes gently and stretch just to the very beginning of resistance.  Avoid any bouncing.  Maybe even do some gentle toe raises at first, many repetitions, light load.  Then try the stretches again and again, gradually working the calf loose without causing any more achilles irritation.  You want to reach a point where you have increased the ankle flex well beyond the starting point, with enough effort to show improvement but not cause damage.  It might hurt a very little but never sharp or severe.

OK.  Thanks.  This is helpful.   Yoga instruction can help a lot…

Will consider this. Cheers, Liz Liz Day Indianapolis, Indiana, USA USDA zone 5b

Response:

I had achilles tendonitis (only one tendon) when I first started.  I iced the sucker 2-3 times a day, including immersing the heel in a bucket of ice water. I used heel lifts in both walking and running shoes (though I should add I did almost no running for first month).  I could feel the scar tissue on the tendon.  I did no stretching having read that stretching of tendon injuries makes them worse.  Light stretching of muscle damage seems to be OK OTOH.  Once the pain had gone I did heel raises regularly. Something I learnt later and now do daily are Ozzie’s calf rolling exercises.  I use a wooden dowel as have no handy railings out in the south texas brush.  I agree with Ozzie that tight calves are a precursor to achillies tendonitis.  It took 3 months before I had no pain in the tendon. Good luck. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Greetings!… I hope there are some of you out there who can help, I’m at a loss. I injured both Achilles tendons and don’t understand how to help them heal. I’m 42 and have been running about three years, 2-3 miles every other day. Until 3 weeks ago when this happened, I could run an 8:00 mile (not fabulous, but I felt good). Now I can barely walk. I went to a sports doctor, who said the injury isn’t that severe, and showed me stretches against the wall that are supposed to help.  Two friends who run, and a book ("Listen to your pain"), say that you have to carefully move tendons, or they heal too short and with scar tissue. So I’ve been doing these stretches, but a lot of things don’t make sense. I start to feel better, then they hurt again. Am frightened I’m doing something wrong. 1. How can you tell how far to stretch??? Is there some range of motion you’re aiming for?  Or what criteria do you use? I don’t understand how it’s supposed to feel if you’re doing it right. People say to stretch just to the edge of discomfort or pain, but since the pain doesn’t happen until later, after the stretch, it’s impossible to tell.  Also, I don’t know what amount of pain after stretching is normal, and what amount means you overdid it.  How can you tell whether you’re helping it heal or just re-injuring yourself? 2. Friends suggest using a "night splint" while sleeping. Any of you ever try this?  Looks pretty awkward to me – like if you were wearing one while asleep, and tried to shift position, you might get it caught in the covers and twist your leg. True? There are other questions, but this is enough for now. Aside from the practical problems of not being able to get around, and the frustration of not running, the fear and uncertainty are taking a lot out of me. Please advise. Thanks…. Liz Day Indianapolis, Indiana USA www.kiva.net/~daylight

– Regards, Dave

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[[ This message was both posted and mailed: see    the "To," "Cc," and "Newsgroups" headers for details. ]] – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Gordon V Cormack writes: 1. How can you tell how far to stretch???   Is there some range of motion you’re aiming for?  Or what criteria do you use? (b) Do not stretch until the pain is gone.  Stretching will exacerbate the    problem.  If you do stretch, do so only when warm, and not too hard. ???  ACK!!!  Gordon, I was told that if I didn’t stretch the thing, it would heal up all scarred and lose elasticity.  I don’t understand.  How do these pieces of information reconcile?  They say a "gentle" stretch. Whatever that is.  Please help, I’m totally lost.     Liz Liz Day Indianapolis, Indiana, USA

Liz, Again check out, http://www.mindfulness.com/of1.asp As  you roll the calf on the railing from side to side, you easily push the heel away so that you can feel the tension under where you’re rolling the quad. I’ve read the articles that Gordon referenced.  Some good information. But the focus continues to remain on the Achilles Tendon.  It is my folklore that the Achilles Tendon problems are a result of the calves, that is the muscles and/or the fascia around those calf muscles being strong and shortened rather than strong and elongated. The tendons are not suppose to stretch.  They can but they’re not suppose to.  So if one massages or transverse frictions the calves, one begins to realize how much tightness, identified by some as pain, there is in the calf.  If the calf muscle’s knotted areas and the fascia surrounding the knotted areas can be massaged loose, then the calf muscles can once again move through their full range of motion so that the Achilles Tendon doesn’t have to be stessed unnecessarily. Also the problem may be that the shins are too tight and that the calves have to work against an antagonist muscle group that only semi relaxes and therefore puts more strain on the agonist muscle group and therefore stresses the tendon because the muscle isn’t working through its full range as it is suppose to. If you do the calf over a railing or the back of a chair or the edge of a table…that is the belly of the muscle on the edge, you’ll begin to see that stretching is secondary to getting the knotted area and the fascia to let go so that that part of the muscle can work through its full range of motion. If you overstretch, the good muscle fibers are overstretched and to protect themselves, the contract and shorted.  Gradually you find that you can stretch as stretching doesn’t work.   You’ve created  a great shortened muscle and the surrounding fascia to keep it protected from all the overstretching you’ve done to create the problem, thinking that you were stretching. Just some more of my folklore to add to Gordon’s scientific information. In health and on the run, Ozzie Gontang Maintainer – rec.running FAQ Director, San Diego Marathon Clinic, est. 1975 Mindful Running:   http://www.mindfulness.com/mr.asp http://www.faqs.org/faqs/running-faq/

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Stretching is controversial.  Muscle injuries are different from tendon/ligament injuries.  AFAIK, tendons and ligaments don’t heal shorter, but muscles can shorten if you do concentric strength exercise without stretching after. I read the literature a bit when I had my injury, but I did not do a complete study.  I found little solid evidence that stretching did any good or any harm. So I should weaken my statement:  I found that my recovery coincided with cessation of stretching.  An it would appear to me that the eccentric exercises would ensure that proper range of motion is maintained. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Gordon V Cormack writes: 1. How can you tell how far to stretch???   Is there some range of motion you’re aiming for?  Or what criteria do you use? (b) Do not stretch until the pain is gone.  Stretching will exacerbate the    problem.  If you do stretch, do so only when warm, and not too hard. ???  ACK!!!  Gordon, I was told that if I didn’t stretch the thing, it would heal up all scarred and lose elasticity.  I don’t understand.  How do these pieces of information reconcile?  They say a "gentle" stretch. Whatever that is.  Please help, I’m totally lost.     Liz Liz Day Indianapolis, Indiana, USA

– Gordon V. Cormack     CS Dept, University of Waterloo, Canada N2L 3G1

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Gordon V Cormack writes: 1. How can you tell how far to stretch???   Is there some range of motion you’re aiming for?  Or what criteria do you use? (b) Do not stretch until the pain is gone.  Stretching will exacerbate the    problem.  If you do stretch, do so only when warm, and not too hard.

???  ACK!!!  Gordon, I was told that if I didn’t stretch the thing, it would heal up all scarred and lose elasticity.  I don’t understand.  How do these pieces of information reconcile?  They say a "gentle" stretch. Whatever that is.  Please help, I’m totally lost.     Liz Liz Day Indianapolis, Indiana, USA

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Stetching the calf seems to work best in my one experience with sore achilles. You mentioned that after stretching the pain comes back later.  The calf muscle has probably cooled and tightened up again while sleeping or sitting. Helps to massage and stretch gently at any time before standing or arising, or stepping out of shoes with substantial heel lift. Before stretching, first extend the muscle against resistance by contracting it, with the weight on your toes for example. You can also put a heel lift inside some shoes as a temporary measure. Did you get any advice on why the achilles became sore in the first place? Make certain you do not repeat this. Criteria to use. You have to discover your own limits with a conservative approach that does not cause further damage.  Not cut and dry. Getting advice from a physical therapist as well as introduction to some stretching, stretching devices, methods and criteria for how much to stretch would be the best.  The PT’s are often wizards who have a wealth of experience unmatched by anyone else.  Also a massage therapist can teach you some helpful techniques, esp. one who has studied PT. If you can, warm up the body first.  At least begin with warm temperatures.  Start very slowly, flexing the ankle, knee, toes gently and stretch just to the very beginning of resistance.  Avoid any bouncing.  Maybe even do some gentle toe raises at first, many repetitions, light load.  Then try the stretches again and again, gradually working the calf loose without causing any more achilles irritation.  You want to reach a point where you have increased the ankle flex well beyond the starting point, with enough effort to show improvement but not cause damage.  It might hurt a very little but never sharp or severe. Yoga instruction can help a lot with this, esp. once healed.  They use the term:  "finding your edge," to establish how much is enough. Also, if you have tight calf muscles, you probably want to work on other parts of the body to protect yourself and feel better.  Yoga can help with this.  Consider Hatha Yoga taught in the Iyengar style. Avoid power yoga in the beginning, e.g., Ashtanga, unless the instructor knows your history and can advise you. (personal experience only, no formal training to give advice) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Greetings!… 1. How can you tell how far to stretch???   Is there some range of motion you’re aiming for?  Or what criteria do you use? Here’s my personal experience, which seems to be consistent with the scientific information (as opposed to folklore) that one can find. (a) It takes many weeks to heal.  Lay off uphills, sprinting, stair climbing,     lifting exercises for this length of time. (b) Do not stretch until the pain is gone.  Stretching will exacerbate the     problem.  If you do stretch, do so only when warm, and not too hard. (b) Do "eccentric strenghtening".  Put the ball of your foot on a step     and raise up using your other leg.  Transfer the weight to your bad     leg and slowly lower your leg to below the level of the step. (10-15     seconds).  Raise yourself up, using arms/other leg (not the calf muscle).     Repeat several times, and do several sets throughout the day.     cf.  http://www.nismat.org/ptcor/eccentric_achilles/          http://www.pponline.co.uk/encyc/0031.htm          http://www.t-mag.com/html/body_114eex.html         Alfredson, H., Pietila, T., Jonsson, P. & Lorentzon, R. Heavy-load         eccentric calf muscle training for the treatment of chronic Achilles         tendinosis. Am J Sports Med 1998 May-Jun;26(3):360-6         Alfredson, H. & Lorentzon, R. Chronic Achilles tendinosis:         recommendations for treatment and prevention. Sports Med. 2000         Feb;29(2):135-46.

Response:

Greetings!… I hope there are some of you out there who can help, I’m at a loss.   I injured both Achilles tendons and don’t understand how to help them heal. I’m 42 and have been running about three years, 2-3 miles every other day.   Until 3 weeks ago when this happened, I could run an 8:00 mile (not fabulous, but I felt good). Now I can barely walk. I went to a sports doctor, who said the injury isn’t that severe, and showed me stretches against the wall that are supposed to help.  Two friends who run, and a book ("Listen to your pain"), say that you have to carefully move tendons, or they heal too short and with scar tissue. So I’ve been doing these stretches, but a lot of things don’t make sense.   I start to feel better, then they hurt again. Am frightened I’m doing something wrong. 1. How can you tell how far to stretch???   Is there some range of motion you’re aiming for?  Or what criteria do you use? I don’t understand how it’s supposed to feel if you’re doing it right. People say to stretch just to the edge of discomfort or pain, but since the pain doesn’t happen until later, after the stretch, it’s impossible to tell.  Also, I don’t know what amount of pain after stretching is normal, and what amount means you overdid it.  How can you tell whether you’re helping it heal or just re-injuring yourself? 2. Friends suggest using a "night splint" while sleeping. Any of you ever try this?  Looks pretty awkward to me – like if you were wearing one while asleep, and tried to shift position, you might get it caught in the covers and twist your leg. True? There are other questions, but this is enough for now. Aside from the practical problems of not being able to get around, and the frustration of not running, the fear and uncertainty are taking a lot out of me. Please advise. Thanks…. Liz Day Indianapolis, Indiana USA www.kiva.net/~daylight

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Greetings!… 1. How can you tell how far to stretch???   Is there some range of motion you’re aiming for?  Or what criteria do you use?

Here’s my personal experience, which seems to be consistent with the scientific information (as opposed to folklore) that one can find. (a) It takes many weeks to heal.  Lay off uphills, sprinting, stair climbing,     lifting exercises for this length of time. (b) Do not stretch until the pain is gone.  Stretching will exacerbate the     problem.  If you do stretch, do so only when warm, and not too hard. (b) Do "eccentric strenghtening".  Put the ball of your foot on a step     and raise up using your other leg.  Transfer the weight to your bad     leg and slowly lower your leg to below the level of the step. (10-15     seconds).  Raise yourself up, using arms/other leg (not the calf muscle).     Repeat several times, and do several sets throughout the day.     cf.  http://www.nismat.org/ptcor/eccentric_achilles/          http://www.pponline.co.uk/encyc/0031.htm          http://www.t-mag.com/html/body_114eex.html         Alfredson, H., Pietila, T., Jonsson, P. & Lorentzon, R. Heavy-load         eccentric calf muscle training for the treatment of chronic Achilles         tendinosis. Am J Sports Med 1998 May-Jun;26(3):360-6         Alfredson, H. & Lorentzon, R. Chronic Achilles tendinosis:         recommendations for treatment and prevention. Sports Med. 2000         Feb;29(2):135-46. — Gordon V. Cormack     CS Dept, University of Waterloo, Canada N2L 3G1

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Question:

You may also want to check out Viniyoga. There is no "degree" but the training is quite intense. Gary Kraftsow is running workshops and teacher training this year in Hawaii and Utah.

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If you want the information, I recommend studding with Aadil Palkivala in Seattle (www.yogacenters.com ). He is an advanced certified teacher who studied with Iyengar from the age of seven and fully understands his therapeutics. The piece of paper doesn’t exist. — Colin Earl www.srichakrayoga.com

I second that!  He is amazing and well worth spending anytime you can get with him. — ~Stu

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Hi, I know of this institute called "Prashanti Kuteeram" in Bangalore,India. The full name is SVYASA-Swami Vivekananda Yoga Anusandhana Samsthana. Its a really great institute for Yoga Therapy. I have attended a course over there myself twice and its located away from all the city noise/pollution in the woods. The food is great and they teach Patanjala Yoga with lot of importance to mind calmness through relaxation. The type of disorders they cure by yoga therapy is very vast and encompasses most of the common ailments. THey also do  post heart attack care, cancer, mental illnesses and the like. If you are looking for a good place to get a certification for Yoga instruction for Yoga therapy , then I would suggest this place. This is affiliated to the Bangalore University and Mangalore University. THey have a research center funded by Dept. of Science and Technology , India. They are also starting a Phd program. Good luck, Anil Hi, does anyone know of an accredited course of studies in Yoga therapy, comparable to a Bsc or an Msc? I know some yog arelated units are available in certain degrees but I haven’t heard of anything devoted mainly to Yoga. P

,

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Hi, does anyone know of an accredited course of studies in Yoga therapy, comparable to a Bsc or an Msc? I know some yog arelated units are available in certain degrees but I haven’t heard of anything devoted mainly to Yoga. P

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If you want the information, I recommend studding with Aadil Palkivala in Seattle (www.yogacenters.com ). He is an advanced certified teacher who studied with Iyengar from the age of seven and fully understands his therapeutics. The piece of paper doesn’t exist. — Colin Earl www.srichakrayoga.com

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, does anyone know of an accredited course of studies in Yoga therapy, comparable to a Bsc or an Msc? I know some yog arelated units are available in certain degrees but I haven’t heard of anything devoted mainly to Yoga. P

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Question:

Zen Meditation might work for you. You concentrate on the tortuous position of semi or full lotus position while sitting on small pillows to straighten your posture. You are then able to concentrate on the breathing techniques (belly breathing) and the pain you are in from sitting that way. [snipped]

Thanks John. I’ve not been faithful about practice and now that trying to still the ‘monkey’ has become a dire priority, I need to practice, practice, practice. Maybe I should find a cushion to warm.  The carpet just kills my chubby cheeks. I’ve never been able to get into full lotus but…practice, practice, practice.  I’ve got, what, ten years to go? Thanks, d’ —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

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The rosary can also be used in contemplative meditative prayer…after all, when you get down to it, the full rosary is nothing but chanting between 150-1500+ prayers (depending on how many Mysteries you are covering-I have never done them all at one time Are there any sites listing one or more of them?

I put rosary on my search engine and came up with these: http://rosary.virtualave.net/ http://hometown.aol.com/davecheney/rosary.html (just lists the mysteries, and does not have meditations on them) http://www.usaor.net/users/grace/rosary.htm  (This is given as the Anglican rosary, and while our churches are similar [I am Catholic], I have not read this particular site, and do not know of the differences) — Buny —-"Nobody realizes that some people expend tremendous energy merely to be normal."  ~  Albert Camus

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Zen Meditation might work for you. You concentrate on the tortuous position of semi or full lotus position while sitting on small pillows to straighten your posture. You are then able to concentrate on the breathing techniques (belly breathing) and the pain you are in from sitting that way. [snipped] Thanks John.

Your Welcome. It was me,Terra Celeste, excellent brownie baker and procrastinator extraordinare that made the original suggestion of Zazen,but John Clarke made the very good point on flexibility and full-lotus.  Another thing to pursue might be helpful-deep tissue massage/body work. It is very good at chasing away the blues that hide deep in your muscles-seriously-stored emotional and physical traumas. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve not been faithful about practice and now that trying to still the ‘monkey’ has become a dire priority, I need to practice, practice, practice. Maybe I should find a cushion to warm.  The carpet just kills my chubby cheeks. I’ve never been able to get into full lotus but…practice, practice, practice.  I’ve got, what, ten years to go? Thanks, d’ —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

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Thanks! I wonder if "harp song" — the modal pattern of some American Protestant hymnry — is meditational. E. P.

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says… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Zen Meditation might work for you. You concentrate on the tortuous position of semi or full lotus position while sitting on small pillows to straighten your posture. You are then able to concentrate on the breathing techniques (belly breathing) and the pain you are in from sitting that way. [snipped] Thanks John. I’ve not been faithful about practice and now that trying to still the ‘monkey’ has become a dire priority, I need to practice, practice, practice. Maybe I should find a cushion to warm.  The carpet just kills my chubby cheeks. I’ve never been able to get into full lotus but…practice, practice, practice.  I’ve got, what, ten years to go?

Definitely find a good smooth surface–carpet is not all that comfortable, and can be downright abrasive.  Any decent exercise- equipment store should have a nice folding mat that’s good for all kinds of things and doens’t take up much space when folded. If you’re not taking formal yoga instruction, or even if you are, you may find "Stretching" by Bob & Jean Anderson to be helpful.  I was amazed at how much more extension I was getting after a few weeks of daily effort.  Then one thing led to another and my attention deficited and I need to get back to that. There’s a new edition out–look for the 20th Anniversary Edition. Thanks, d’ —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

– — –John Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net (used to be jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

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when can you concentrate.  You can meditate while moving if it’s nice safe and familiar.  Go for a nice swim or a nice run and then it will make it easier to focus because that’s what happens when you move or run.  If your body is allowed to move then your mind will eventually learn to be still.  You are trying to hard to concentrate Anan.  Performance has no place in meditation. It is to relax and be at peace within yourself and with who you are.  When or where ever you are able to do that you are meditating.  You could be swimming as fast as you can and be still within you like you aren’t even moving at all. That is how we meditate you have to go a different way to peacefulness but you still can get there the road isn’t blocked.  Forget where you are what you are doing what time it is how old you are and everything that seems important for a while find a safe place meaning no one around and run so fast you forget it all.  Meditation is to give you a respite from the noise and confusion assaulting your brain you already do it you just don’t call it that. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – With my mind like a lotto ball in the hopper, how can I meditate?  I’ve never been able to pray silently or aloud because my train of thought derails and all the passengers get off the train.  I’ve taken to writing my prayers and meditations as "essays".  They take an incredibly long time, some are still an ongoing dialogue between me and the devil’s advocate that is my internal editor [no other "voices", yet.] I discovered this Spring that certain music helps.  I call it my "brain pacifier".  I’m left-handed so I’m not sure which side of the brain’s supposed to control what, so I call it my "logical brain" vs. my "creative brain".  When I listen to certain baroque music, I seem to be able to focus for a few seconds more than usual.  Like writing these last two paragraphs. All things Bach work as does Pachelbel.  Mozart’s a bit frenetic…I keep thinking of "Amadeus".  Anyway, sometimes it’s almost as good as the meds before they stopped working. Does anybody else have this problem and how do you cope? Thanks, d’ Anankast — Of all the things I’ve lost, I miss my mind the most. —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

–  -Katz Heitmann  I never went to kindergarden so all I needed to know I learned from  Shakespeare. You won’t survive long if you live in a Shakespearian tragedy. There are few human problems which can not be solved with the jucicious  application of high explosives.  (And if that doesn’t work, try duct tape) Reach out and byte someone:) -Compass Media

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – With my mind like a lotto ball in the hopper, how can I meditate?  I’ve never been able to pray silently or aloud because my train of thought derails and all the passengers get off the train.  I’ve taken to writing my prayers and meditations as "essays".  They take an incredibly long time, some are still an ongoing dialogue between me and the devil’s advocate that is my internal editor [no other "voices", yet.] I discovered this Spring that certain music helps.  I call it my "brain pacifier".  I’m left-handed so I’m not sure which side of the brain’s supposed to control what, so I call it my "logical brain" vs. my "creative brain".  When I listen to certain baroque music, I seem to be able to focus for a few seconds more than usual.  Like writing these last two paragraphs. All things Bach work as does Pachelbel.  Mozart’s a bit frenetic…I keep thinking of "Amadeus".  Anyway, sometimes it’s almost as good as the meds before they stopped working.

When I am working or writing, I too find Baroque music to be wonderful background music. I have Back and Packelbel in my CD player right now. I also like to work to Purcel and Vivaldi. Both Mozart and Beethoven are too distracting to work by, as much as I like them. And forget Mahler. Can’t work to Mahler, no way, no how! Nancy Unique, like everyone else

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I have a rock garden water trickle thingy that I haven’t set up yet in my office…one more thing to plug in.

I find the bubbling sounds from an aquarium works too. And, when you’re trying to relax, looking at the fish is very soothing. But I don’t think most people could watch aquarium fish and work at the same time. But YMMV. I’ve been thinking of getting one of those little water trickling fountains, but all the one’s I’ve seen that I can afford are, IMO, ugly to look at. <sigh Nancy Unique, like everyone else

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The rosary can also be used in contemplative meditative prayer…after all, when you get down to it, the full rosary is nothing but chanting between 150-1500+ prayers (depending on how many Mysteries you are covering-I have never done them all at one time

Yep. When I was as a kid, there was nothing like saying the rosary, especially with a group so I could just rather mindlessly recite along, to send my mind into a different zone. Nancy Unique, like everyone else

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Thanks Andy.  It sounds like I have to "get" there the same way I’m going to get to Carnegie Hall….practice, practice, practice.  I may explore the local area and see if there might be a teacher to help first.  I’ve used yoga books for years to help maintain flexibility but the closest exercise has ever gotten me to that plane I’m looking for has been the runner’s high…back when I could run.

My mind often got into a different zone when I ran, but IMO, not because of the runner’s high. It’s hard to explain. But there’s something about the repetitive movements over a long period of time that don’t require a lot of thought that does it for me. I zoned out easier while running on a track than on the road because on the track I didn’t have to be aware of much of anything external. I found stationary biking to do the same; swimming laps too. Walking on a tread mill is trickier. I could kind of zone on a long walk (45 minutes or more), but OTOH, zone out too much and you’d could find yourself flying off the back of the treadmill. Exercise that doesn’t require repetitive motion doesn’t seem to have the same effect, nor does an exercise class in which I can socialize while I’m working out. Running with someone else didn’t work either, as I’d chat while running instead of zoning out. I find walking through the neighborhood doesn’t have the same effect either, as there’s too many nice things to look at and enjoy for my mind to go somewhere else. Nancy Unique, like everyone else

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My mind often got into a different zone when I ran, but IMO, not because of the runner’s high. It’s hard to explain. But there’s something about the repetitive movements over a long period of time that don’t require a lot of thought that does it for me.

T’ai Chi is often called "meditation in motion" precisely because of that. When you are first learning the form(s), it feels very artificial, like learning the steps to a rather complex dance (which is kind of is…).  But once you have done it often enough, it gets to be second nature (which is the point-it becomes a reflex, which is why it is a good martial art…someone attacks, and you respond without needing to think about it). At this point, you can move through the form, letting your mind go into "auto-pilot"–that is when the meditative side kicks in. FWIW, the words "king fu" don’t even mean anything like martial art (that is "wu shu").  It translates into English as "mastery through time and effort". I.e., if you get good at something through a lot of time and practice, you show kung fu in that thing. I also expereinced this when I was in the high school band, marching in football game half-time shows.  It was almost an out-of-body experience. Cool, once I realized what had happened-but the first time, fear snapped me right back. I zoned out easier while running on a track than on the road because on the track I didn’t have to be aware of much of anything external.

"Zoning out"…perfect description! — Buny —-"Nobody realizes that some people expend tremendous energy merely to be normal."  ~  Albert Camus

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[ . . . ] I’ve been thinking of getting one of those little water trickling fountains, but all the one’s I’ve seen that I can afford are, IMO, ugly to look at. <sigh

Make your own!  Pumps are relatively cheap. E. P.

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[ . . . ] I’ve been thinking of getting one of those little water trickling fountains, but all the one’s I’ve seen that I can afford are, IMO, ugly to look at. <sigh Make your own!  Pumps are relatively cheap.

Good idea. Let’s seem, my free time for undertaking a project like this, is, hmm…YS is 10 now…probably sometime in 2011. Nancy Unique, like everyone else

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Sure can and you can do it 24/7 to maintain control.  ADHD is a "Gift", and as such, it takes understanding and nurturing. I find that to many of us are buying into this "Normal" thing.  You are "Normal" for someone who is ADHD. 1…Let the power flow through you unhindered.   2…Follow it, and see where it leads you. 3…Never let it control you – Never try to control it. 4…When it runs out of steam, you will be faced with a blank screen. 5…The blank screen is the desired state of consciousness. 6…Now let the intuitive mind be your guiding force. This is where the power of ADHD is.  "The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift."   [ Albert Einstein (1879-1955) ] Einstein was ADHD, he intuitively developed the "Theory of Relativity".  This would not be possible with the "normal" abilities of cognitive rational.  You see, there were no numbers to crunch, only a visioning process could work here. In other words:  He Hyper-Focused into a Daydream, and over a period of years he kept building on this theory he knew was real. Each step of the way he got a little closer to completion, but I am willing to bet, the real problem was his transferring that which was in his head to a form the "Mundane’s" could understand. Einstein understood his gift, but what he did not know was that those around him could not think like him.  When you read his writings, this becomes quite evident to those of us that under stand the "Gift". AND, this proves my point rather nicely; "Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocre minds. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence."  [ Albert Einstein (1879-1955) ] (Only a ADHDevil would say it this way.) If you don’t visit here on a regular basis, you aint "Pure ADHDeveloped": For my ADHDevilish friends out there with the Einstein IQ’s who when sitting across from someone who’s scruntching their face and smirking at you while you tell them something so brilliant that it borders the esoteric realm of perceptive discernment only attained by the gods themselves, but that smirk is that all to often painful reminder of "I should have kept my mouth shut, because this…this..person just can’t go there…it’s light years ahead and over their head".  As you bang your forehead on the table wondering why you opened that silly size 10 EEE orifice, you are being ridiculed as a fruitcake with sounds of snickers followed by the infamous lines of the "Mundane’s";  Get real man, what planet are you from? If you think about the complaints that are generated about ADHD, then you will see they are all based on not being "Normal".  I Thank the Gods and Goddesses every day that I am not "Normal".  Life is much more interesting being "Dennis  the Menace" than the alternitive of being "Mr. Wilson". Dum Vivimus Vivamus While We Live, Let Us Live Poetic Justice to all and may the God of Irony always be with you.

Response:

Zen Meditation might work for you. You concentrate on the tortuous position of semi or full lotus position while sitting on small pillows to straighten your posture. You are then able to concentrate on the breathing techniques (belly breathing) and the pain you are in from sitting that way.

Just a comment, but if full-lotus is painful for you, you need to work on flexibility.  It’s actually a rather well thought out position that doesn’t put pressure on any major arteries, hence you can hold it indefinitely without cutting off circulation anywhere.  When I was younger I had no trouble at all with it, to the amazement of my friends, as I have never _looked_ particularly flexible in that regard.  However 50 is coming fast and what you don’t use you lose . . . – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Eventually your mind calms (and your legs numb (wink)) The fleeting thoughts are not a problem- you let them go in and out,and you try to focus by counting to 10 -one count for each set of inhalation and exhalation.  It used to be very helpful to me in both mood adjustment and overall focus, but the trick is sticking to it. Every one used to tell me,"20 minutes a day is all you need-do it first thing in the morning." Well,…easier said than done,but great when I do…  According to Zen priests in regard to the practice of Zazen,"The first 10 years of practice,you are just warming the cushions"  So if you’re interested,better get to work! "Chattering monkey " was how one therapist I had briefly when studying abroad in my 20’s described my brain. How insightful he was- even w/out dxing my ADD! With my mind like a lotto ball in the hopper, how can I meditate? I’ve never been able to pray silently or aloud because my train of thought derails and all the passengers get off the train. [snip] Does anybody else have this problem and how do you cope? Hi — I’m new to this newsgroup, but maybe I can help here. I’ve had ADD since I was a kid, and I’ve been practicing the Transcendental Meditation technique (Maharishi Mahesh Yogi’s technique) for 33 years (today is my anniversary, in fact).  I practice TM twice a day, and it’s a wonderful break from the ADD experience.  When I do it, my usual chaotic thoughts gradually become less demanding and finally just fade away, leaving me in a really blissful state of mind.  It’s a very natural and effortless process.  You don’t do anything to make the thoughts go away, it just happens automatically.  It was really easy to learn, and I’ve found it to be beneficial in other ways as well. If you’re interested, their website is: http://www.tm.org/ or I could try to answer any questions. — Andy Averill Fairfield, IA Thanks Andy.  It sounds like I have to "get" there the same way I’m going to get to Carnegie Hall….practice, practice, practice.  I may explore the local area and see if there might be a teacher to help first.  I’ve used yoga books for years to help maintain flexibility but the closest exercise has ever gotten me to that plane I’m looking for has been the runner’s high…back when I could run. Maybe I should stop "looking" for it and learn to just let it happen. Maybe now that I’ve escaped Washington, D.C. I can. Thanks, d’ —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—– —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

– — –John Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net (used to be jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

Response:

Zen Meditation might work for you. You concentrate on the tortuous position of semi or full lotus position while sitting on small pillows to straighten your posture. You are then able to concentrate on the breathing techniques (belly breathing) and the pain you are in from sitting that way. Eventually your mind calms (and your legs numb (wink)) The fleeting thoughts are not a problem- you let them go in and out,and you try to focus by counting to 10 -one count for each set of inhalation and exhalation.  It used to be very helpful to me in both mood adjustment and overall focus, but the trick is sticking to it. Every one used to tell me,"20 minutes a day is all you need-do it first thing in the morning." Well,…easier said than done,but great when I do…  According to Zen priests in regard to the practice of Zazen,"The first 10 years of practice,you are just warming the cushions"  So if you’re interested,better get to work! "Chattering monkey " was how one therapist I had briefly when studying abroad in my 20’s described my brain. How insightful he was- even w/out dxing my ADD!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – With my mind like a lotto ball in the hopper, how can I meditate? I’ve never been able to pray silently or aloud because my train of thought derails and all the passengers get off the train. [snip] Does anybody else have this problem and how do you cope? Hi — I’m new to this newsgroup, but maybe I can help here. I’ve had ADD since I was a kid, and I’ve been practicing the Transcendental Meditation technique (Maharishi Mahesh Yogi’s technique) for 33 years (today is my anniversary, in fact).  I practice TM twice a day, and it’s a wonderful break from the ADD experience.  When I do it, my usual chaotic thoughts gradually become less demanding and finally just fade away, leaving me in a really blissful state of mind.  It’s a very natural and effortless process.  You don’t do anything to make the thoughts go away, it just happens automatically.  It was really easy to learn, and I’ve found it to be beneficial in other ways as well. If you’re interested, their website is: http://www.tm.org/ or I could try to answer any questions. — Andy Averill Fairfield, IA Thanks Andy.  It sounds like I have to "get" there the same way I’m going to get to Carnegie Hall….practice, practice, practice.  I may explore the local area and see if there might be a teacher to help first.  I’ve used yoga books for years to help maintain flexibility but the closest exercise has ever gotten me to that plane I’m looking for has been the runner’s high…back when I could run. Maybe I should stop "looking" for it and learn to just let it happen. Maybe now that I’ve escaped Washington, D.C. I can. Thanks, d’ —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—– —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

Basic methods of meditational prayer are possible even for us. Catholics know various methods of reciting the Ave Maria.  Gregorian chant is very meditative, as is modern Taize and Anglican chants. The Jesus Prayer can be used for meditation, as can the Lord’s Prayer.

The rosary can also be used in contemplative meditative prayer…after all, when you get down to it, the full rosary is nothing but chanting between 150-1500+ prayers (depending on how many Mysteries you are covering-I have never done them all at one time — Buny —-"Nobody realizes that some people expend tremendous energy merely to be normal."  ~  Albert Camus

Response:

The rosary can also be used in contemplative meditative prayer…after all, when you get down to it, the full rosary is nothing but chanting between 150-1500+ prayers (depending on how many Mysteries you are covering-I have never done them all at one time

Are there any sites listing one or more of them? E. P.

Response:

Basic methods of meditational prayer are possible even for us. Catholics know various methods of reciting the Ave Maria.  Gregorian chant is very meditative, as is modern Taize and Anglican chants. The Jesus Prayer can be used for meditation, as can the Lord’s Prayer. E. P.

Thanks. When I was in the midst of my melt-down eleven years ago, I would repeat the Lord’s Prayer as fast as possible as often as possible at the oddest times…over and over and over. When you fear you’re going crazy, you don’t trust the things you thought you knew to be true. That prayer resided in a little corner of my brain where I was still eight years old and just learning it as it was recited by my public school classmates at every school assembly (I was a pagan Army brat and had never heard it before.  And, yes, back before the invention of the wheel, the school principal would lead the children in prayer followed by "In Jesus name we pray" and I always wondered, at eight, what the Jewish kids might think about that.) The prayer was always in lower case for me.  I never imagined talking to GOD, or God, or even a god.  My concept was unformed even after seven years of Methodist Sunday school…we finally started when I was nine. I don’t do well with prayers written by others.  Litergy is babble to me. But every once in a while a phrase will jump out at me and I’ll throw it into the hopper.  I feel nothing spiritual about it, only academic. So when I pray, by writing it out, it’s like writing a letter to a dear friend…or to one of you in the NG.  I feel no relief other than having been able to string two thoughts together in and among my fitful…monkey mind, Bunny calls it. I first heard the Gregorian Chants when I was in high school…I think Gregory was Pope at the time.  Maybe I’ll give them a try though Bach requires nothing in relief. When you fear you’re going crazy, you don’t trust the things you thought you knew to be true.  Of course, I once knew the world to be flat.  I understand there’s been a recent change. I only that all truth comes from God, whatever his or her name.  I just don’t know what that means to me. Thanks, Tchuss, d’ Anankast —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

Basic methods of meditational prayer are possible even for us. Catholics know various methods of reciting the Ave Maria.  Gregorian chant is very meditative, as is modern Taize and Anglican chants. The Jesus Prayer can be used for meditation, as can the Lord’s Prayer.   E. P.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <<<snipped Actually, amnny ADHDers can do the equivilant of medication-it is called "hyperfocus".  FWIW, when I took Chinese kung fu/t’ai chi for 3 1/2 years, I also had trouble with the before- and after-class medications…I had what was referred to as the "monkey mind", constantly flitting from place to place.  I found that I could best concentrate and medicate with music in the background-or if that was not there, water falling.  I wonder if this is because i am a musician, but I never could completely "empty the mind"-but could almost do it if I could concentrate, hyperfocus, on music.

A "monkey mind" eh?  I was called "monkey butt" once long ago but those kind of initiations are illegal now. I have a rock garden water trickle thingy that I haven’t set up yet in my office…one more thing to plug in. Empty head, yes.  Empty mind, never. Only certain kinds of music work for me: instrumental, complex….usually baroque. I’ve never thought of hyperfocus as meditation since I only seem to do it when I’m writing [without researching and cross referencing and such] Just free form writing.  That’s why writing my prayers seems to be closer to the experience. Your friend,      Monkey Butt — Buny —-"Nobody realizes that some people expend tremendous energy merely to be normal."  ~  Albert Camus

—–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – With my mind like a lotto ball in the hopper, how can I meditate?  I’ve never been able to pray silently or aloud because my train of thought derails and all the passengers get off the train. [snip] Does anybody else have this problem and how do you cope? Hi — I’m new to this newsgroup, but maybe I can help here. I’ve had ADD since I was a kid, and I’ve been practicing the Transcendental Meditation technique (Maharishi Mahesh Yogi’s technique) for 33 years (today is my anniversary, in fact).  I practice TM twice a day, and it’s a wonderful break from the ADD experience.  When I do it, my usual chaotic thoughts gradually become less demanding and finally just fade away, leaving me in a really blissful state of mind.  It’s a very natural and effortless process.  You don’t do anything to make the thoughts go away, it just happens automatically.  It was really easy to learn, and I’ve found it to be beneficial in other ways as well. If you’re interested, their website is: http://www.tm.org/ or I could try to answer any questions. — Andy Averill Fairfield, IA

Thanks Andy.  It sounds like I have to "get" there the same way I’m going to get to Carnegie Hall….practice, practice, practice.  I may explore the local area and see if there might be a teacher to help first.  I’ve used yoga books for years to help maintain flexibility but the closest exercise has ever gotten me to that plane I’m looking for has been the runner’s high…back when I could run. Maybe I should stop "looking" for it and learn to just let it happen. Maybe now that I’ve escaped Washington, D.C. I can. Thanks, d’ —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

—–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

With my mind like a lotto ball in the hopper, how can I meditate?  I’ve never been able to pray silently or aloud because my train of thought derails and all the passengers get off the train.

[snip] Does anybody else have this problem and how do you cope?

Hi — I’m new to this newsgroup, but maybe I can help here. I’ve had ADD since I was a kid, and I’ve been practicing the Transcendental Meditation technique (Maharishi Mahesh Yogi’s technique) for 33 years (today is my anniversary, in fact).  I practice TM twice a day, and it’s a wonderful break from the ADD experience.  When I do it, my usual chaotic thoughts gradually become less demanding and finally just fade away, leaving me in a really blissful state of mind.  It’s a very natural and effortless process.  You don’t do anything to make the thoughts go away, it just happens automatically.  It was really easy to learn, and I’ve found it to be beneficial in other ways as well. If you’re interested, their website is: http://www.tm.org/ or I could try to answer any questions. — Andy Averill Fairfield, IA —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

I discovered this Spring that certain music helps.  I call it my "brain pacifier".  I’m left-handed so I’m not sure which side of the brain’s supposed to control what, so I call it my "logical brain" vs. my "creative brain".  When I listen to certain baroque music, I seem to be able to focus for a few seconds more than usual.  Like writing these last two paragraphs. All things Bach work as does Pachelbel.  Mozart’s a bit frenetic…I keep thinking of "Amadeus".  Anyway, sometimes it’s almost as good as the meds before they stopped working.

Actually, amnny ADHDers can do the equivilant of medication-it is called "hyperfocus".  FWIW, when I took Chinese kung fu/t’ai chi for 3 1/2 years, I also had trouble with the before- and after-class medications…I had what was referred to as the "monkey mind", constantly flitting from place to place.  I found that I could best concentrate and medicate with music in the background-or if that was not there, water falling.  I wonder if this is because i am a musician, but I never could completely "empty the mind"-but could almost do it if I could concentrate, hyperfocus, on music. — Buny —-"Nobody realizes that some people expend tremendous energy merely to be normal."  ~  Albert Camus

Response:

With my mind like a lotto ball in the hopper, how can I meditate?  I’ve never been able to pray silently or aloud because my train of thought derails and all the passengers get off the train.  I’ve taken to writing my prayers and meditations as "essays".  They take an incredibly long time, some are still an ongoing dialogue between me and the devil’s advocate that is my internal editor [no other "voices", yet.] I discovered this Spring that certain music helps.  I call it my "brain pacifier".  I’m left-handed so I’m not sure which side of the brain’s supposed to control what, so I call it my "logical brain" vs. my "creative brain".  When I listen to certain baroque music, I seem to be able to focus for a few seconds more than usual.  Like writing these last two paragraphs. All things Bach work as does Pachelbel.  Mozart’s a bit frenetic…I keep thinking of "Amadeus".  Anyway, sometimes it’s almost as good as the meds before they stopped working. Does anybody else have this problem and how do you cope? Thanks, d’ Anankast — Of all the things I’ve lost, I miss my mind the most. —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

Question:

Nada yoga. Ok, there are so many sites about yoga.  It’s tough to sort through and get an answer to a basic question:  How does one find introductions to yoga in one’s area (i.e. Northern Virginia)?  And what do you recommend as the most enjoyable form?  Thanks for any suggestions.  Christine

– – Internet newsgroup posting. Claudio Solis

Question:

$50.00 an hour? how many hours would it take for you to teach you formula, or system, what ever you call IT. And then what? are they on their own, what do you teach that can’t be learned from a Book? 50.00 and hour, do you walk on water????? —

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – inlight, we’ve tangled before, but a ‘con’, that’s misuse of language. suppose i told you i’m a converted hindu, then you would think it’s ok for me to offer classes. What if i’m hindu but no very little about yoga? What if i am a judgemental person who thinks they’re way is the only one? Anyway thanks for posting my listing again. peace, sandra

Response:

inlight, we’ve tangled before, but a ‘con’, that’s misuse of language. suppose i told you i’m a converted hindu, then you would think it’s ok for me to offer classes. What if i’m hindu but no very little about yoga? What if i am a judgemental person who thinks they’re way is the only one?         Anyway thanks for posting my listing again. peace, sandra

Response:

<< Certified yoga teacher 15 yrs. experience will train in your home. I can set up a program to fit your needs. Gentle, realistic, effective yoga instruction. Single session 90 minutes, $50 per hour. Will travel in Thousand Oaks CA, and surrounding area. Call Sandra 805 496-1303 The above is "perfect" example of a "yoga" con  Be very wary of anyone who arrogantly claims: "I am a Yoga teacher." Maya, Maya, Maya  

Response:

Certified yoga teacher 15 yrs. experience will train in your home. I can set up a program to fit your needs. Gentle, realistic, effective yoga instruction. Single session 90 minutes, $50 per hour. Will travel in Thousand Oaks CA, and surrounding area. Call Sandra 805 496-1303

Response:

Question:

Can anyone recommend which cassette tutorials on yoga are the best?

Response:

My favorite yoga video workout series is done by a guy named Brian Kest he has three videos (beg. int. adv.) very good about keeping your focus on breathing and relaxing into your pose."Be where you are at."

Response:

Question:

Hi there, I teach yoga in Toronto. For details write to — remove the XXX from the e-mail address when replying Thanks                            "Have a nice day"

Response:

Hi there, I am a Yoga instructor in Toronto. I undertake private lessons. Thank You —                            "Have a nice day"

Response:

instruction is also available free of charge at the University

Response:

Dear Peter, Don’t know if this would help you at all, but when I was visiting Toronto this past winter, we ate at a really great vegetarian restaurant (The Vegetarian Restaurant is what it was called, I think.) They had for the taking a publication on a vegetarian club in Toronto. Seemed pretty comprehensive. Maybe they have a Website that you could use to contact someone in their organization. I’m sure many of them would be into yoga. Also, I was seeking a reputable acupuncturist while I was there and asked the waitress, who regretably couldn’t tell me of one in particular, but mentioned a wellness center across the street from the restaurant that she would have ordinarily consulted for a referral, (but it was Sunday and they were closed). If you could locate this wellness center, maybe you could get yoga referrals from them. Ultimately, I think your best bet would be to ask around locally in circles that would typically have individuals who are into yoga. Health food stores, vegetarian restaurants, wellness centers, etc. Good luck, Denise Burch

Response:

Having just got back from Kripalu, I am enthused (yet again!) about doing yoga on a daily basis.  I have done yoga on and off for many years but find it impossible to keep a regular regime without the support of others.  I am looking for information on where in Toronto I can find a group to practise regularly together. I used to go to the Toronto Kripalu Centre, where morning sadhana was held Monday to Friday at 6:15 am.  This was ideal and I am looking for something similar, preferably early in the morning.  I am not really looking for yoga instruction (I’m not saying I don’t need advice and pointers on technique!).  Rather, I am looking for regular yoga sessions, optimally with a leader who would guide rather than instruct. If I can’t find a centre which fits the bill, I would be interested in hearing from other like-minded individuals, to see if we could form our own such support group.  I live close to High Park, so people living in this vicinity would be of particular interest.  However, I would be prepared to drive, as long as it were not too far. Any and all information and ideas are welcome.  Please respond by e-mail and, optionally, to the newsgroup.  Please remember to remove the obvious from my e-mail address to reply. Peter Davies

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Question:

I have Myasthenia Gravis and I am unable to perform the standard exercises.     I    think I would be able to do Yoga despite my condition. I am looking for inexpensive classes in Nyc or  Queens. please email me with any info. thanks

Response:

I have Myasthenia Gravis and I am unable to perform the standard exercises.     I    think I would be able to do Yoga despite my condition. I am looking for inexpensive classes in Nyc or  Queens. please email me with any info. thanks

See the appended protocol for nutritional help for your problem. –Tom Tom Matthews The LIFE EXTENSION FOUNDATION – http://www.lef.org – 800-841-5433 A non-profit membership organization dedicated to the extension of the healthy human lifespan through ground breaking research, innovative ideas and practical methods. LIFE EXTENSION MAGAZINE – Living Healthier – Reaching for Immortality The ULTIMATE source for new health and medical breakthoughs worldwide. MYASTHENIA GRAVIS Please read this before continuing on: DISCLAIMER THE INFORMATION IN THIS PROGRAM (AND ANY ACCOMPANYING PRINTED MATERIAL) IS NOT INTENDED TO REPLACE THE ATTENTION OR ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN OR OTHER HEALTH CARE PROFESSIONAL. ANYONE WHO WISHES TO EMBARK ON ANY DIETARY, DRUG, EXERCISE, OR OTHER LIFESTYLE CHANGE INTENDED TO PREVENT OR TREAT A SPECIFIC DISEASE OR CONDITION SHOULD FIRST CONSULT WITH AND SEEK CLEARANCE FROM A QUALIFIED HEALTH CARE PROFESSIONAL. Myasthenia gravis occurs because of a defect in the transmission of nerve signals from nerve fibers to muscles. The result is severe long-term muscle weakness. Mainstream scientists have not yet conducted studies to explore the relationship between nutrition, nutritional therapies and myasthenia gravis. There are nutritional therapies that appear to play an important role in the functioning and maintenance of muscle tissue. Essential fatty acids are crucial for maintaining the myelin sheath that contains nerve fibers and is often damaged during the course of the disease. Therefore, patients should consider taking 8 capsules a day of MEGA-EPA, a fish oil concentrate that provides a potent dose of the omega 3 fatty acids. Two capsules a day of MEGA-GLA provides the critical omega 6 fatty acid gammalinolenic acid (GLA). The lipotropic agents, choline and inositol are required to utilize the fatty acids; 1,000- 2,000 mg a day of each could be helpful. To boost the levels of the neurotransmitter acetylcholine and to boost neurological cellular energy levels, five capsules a day of Cognitex (which includes choline and inositol) is suggested. Free radical damage should be reduced by taking 3 tablets, 3 times a day of Life Extension Mix. To improve the transmission of nerve signals 400 mg of alpha lipoic acid should be taken twice a day. Vitamin D3 at a dose of 1,000 IU a day could help with calcium ion exchange, which is needed for nerve conduction. Hydergine can be prescribed by your physician in the range of 5-to-20 mg a day, and deprenyl at a dose of 5 mg taken twice a week. Product availability: The essential fatty acids MEGA-EPA and MEGA-GLA along with alpha lipoic acid, vitamin D3, vitamin E, choline, inositol, Cognitex, vitamin D3 and Life Extension Mix can be ordered singly or in a Protocol Pak by calling 1-800-544-4440. Your doctor can prescribe hydergine and deprenyl. If you want to order these products by mail from low cost offshore pharmacies, call 1-800-544-4440  to ask for a list of companies that ship medicines to Americans for personal use only.

Response:

Question:

Thanks for this: a really interesting article. During the exacerbation I had when I was diagnosed (in 1994) I lost the "fine motor skills" in my hands. I was talking with an early childhood teacher one day and she said that they recommended piano playing for children with poor fine motor skills. I started (on an ordinary upright piano) just doing scales, finally ended up playing better than I ever had done. (just a few tunes). Writing wasn’t lost for long, but it took a couple of months before I was playing guitar again.         I really feel that this exercise did help. (and BTW it is different to computer keyboard exercise … the touch is so different.)         A new light on that old joke: Dr will I be able to play the piano after this (operation)?  Why certainly! says dr.  …Oh good, I always wanted to be able to play the piano.<grin

                        Linda ========== – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Josiah Hincks wrote:

A programme recently broadcast on BBC radio in the UK featuring the Canadian Eva Marsh I found of great interest… The BBC’s programme notes follow… —————————————————————-                   *** MESSAGES TO MYSELF ***

=======snip========

The first observation, that repair of damaged myelin begins spontaneously and can be seen 19 days after injury, dispelled the death sentence that damage was irreversible. The second observation, that nearly every damaged nerve is ensheathed in some myelin in 64 days, motivated Eva to make efforts to resume normal movements. Her two little girls were her models for persistence and unrestricted activity. Eva was aware that repair at the cell level in the nervous system cannot translate to recovery without some thought and some physical work.

=========snip=======

Research work on exercise and demyelinating disease that reaffirms Eva’s experience after every episode of disease activity has been ignored. The study by Lenman shows a rapid increase in strength and clinical improvement after subjects with multiple sclerosis did isometric exercises for a month.

===========snip====== — near Queanbeyan, next to Canberra, in Australia. asking the right question is more important than knowing all the answers themoreyouknowthemoreyouknowyoudon’tknowthemoreyouknowthemreyouknowyoudon’t know

Response:

A footnote on this post. The producer just contacted me to say there were a couple of mistakes in the message as follows:

—————————————————————-                  *** MESSAGES TO MYSELF *** ** FACT SHEET to accompany the BBC Radio 4 Programme on EVA MARSH **

<snip

Correction 1. Price missed postage on US and Canadian items. It should read:   EVA