Question:

 I am going to the university nurse now to get stuff pulled out of my ear. Then twill properly be clear, my dear. I was using wet toilet paper as ear plugs, and a chunk got stuck wayyyyy down thar. I’m so stooopid. Mo’ stupid than you. Can you prove it? I dare me to. And I need glue for my reading glasses. Glue I say!

Response:

What university are you attending?  Its in the UK, right? "Lix Tetrax" <scopethel…@hotmail.com

wrote in message

news:1123113839.308442.33040@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

I am going to the university nurse now to get stuff pulled out of my ear. Then twill properly be clear, my dear. I was using wet toilet paper as ear plugs, and a chunk got stuck wayyyyy down thar. I’m so stooopid. Mo’ stupid than you. Can you prove it? I dare me to. And I need glue for my reading glasses. Glue I say!

Response:

I got an eraser stuck in my ear… I was scratching the inside of my ear with a mechanical pencil and the eraser came out inside.. I was 12 or 13 yrs old.. my mom was so mad at me.. she had to use tweezers to get it out -kim

Response:

I was doing a Yoga exercise once and I got my elbow stuck in my ear. True story. Damo

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hahaha, you are such a dork ! -kim

Response:

Lix? How did you lose your bling bling? I’m very sorry to hear such news. No man is an sland. The loss of a bling bling effects us all. Ask not for whomm the Bell tolls. How did it happen? Damo

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Waikato University, its all a sham!

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Hey Damo! Tis a sad and happy tale, *wooshy wooshy flashback special effects*… Twas long ago, a week or perhaps to the day or perhaps next week, that I waz both King and Queen of all the World. People did oft times marvel at by bling-bling, which I obtained when fighting the Dark Lord Sauron, and his sister, Susan. Twas a gigantic, gimungus RUBY-EMERALD-SAPHIRE combination bling-bling with a money back guarantee no less. Any way, yeah I lost it when I was doing the dishes. It fell into a turtles mouth and it went into it’s shell. I know where I can find said turtle, he hangs out with a motor cycle gang called the Salvation Army. So, tis a matter of time, when again, I shall find a special tin opener that opens turtle shells. One of those $4.00 jobs you can get. Then I’ll have a good stern talk and a cup of tea with the turtle, and shall say that he is a bit of an egg, and an egg at that. Then, he might give me back my bling-bling. Or he might not. If he doesn’t, I will result to Plan 9. I will reanimate the recently deceased using nitrous oxide and I will capture Prince Charles! Ahahahahahaha ?!

Response:

It sounds like a plan, Lix. Go for it. And remember, "A bird in the hand catches the worm". Best of luck. Meet up back here at 2100 hours for debriefing. Damo

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Question:

From the May issue of the Harbour Spiel: The laughter movement began ten years ago in India by Dr. Madan Kataria as a way to relieve stress-induced illness. He developed laughter yoga, a series of exercises to stimulate laughter, which led to the development of over 4,000 laughter clubs worldwide. Seven years ago his dream of world peace through laughter gave rise to World Laughter Day, held the first Sunday in May. It is now celebrated on all five continents. Many countries have a family day of laughing, music, dancing, games and contests, all in the name of peace and building community. For more info, visit laughteryoga.org. In Pender Harbour, Teri McLean will hold a laugh-in at Seafarer’s Park Sunday May 1, 10 to noon. There will be laughter yoga (exercise to stimulate real laughter), a loonie laugh contest, games, singing and just a lot of fun. For May Day, she will hold a Looonie Laugh contest on stage at 1 p.m. following a brief laughter exercise and invitation to the audience to come up to share their laugh. The audience will vote for their favourite laugh.

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ahahahahahahaha!!!!!! http://community.webtv.net/elmoemerson/DocElmosHepFile http://community.webtv.net/elmoemerson/TheFamilyAlbum

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Ahahahahahahahahhaha!!!

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Hey, you two loonies, this is for real! Get serious!!! Ahahahahahaha! Spidey

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Ahahahahahahahahahaha!!!

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ahahahahahahaha!!!!!!! http://community.webtv.net/elmoemerson/DocElmosHepFile http://community.webtv.net/elmoemerson/TheFamilyAlbum

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Question:

When I grew up, I was perscribed on medication after medication. Never, did my doctor recommend experimenting with my diet, stretching or any other methods for helping my tics. I found that MINT helps my vocal tics and dense protien foods like meat make them worse. Too much McDonalds probably affects many people. I recommend that people try stretching instead of druging themselves. Instead of jerking your neck, try rotating from side to side, stretching instead of ticking. Dancing is really fun and I find it helps tics. I don’t reccommend swing dancing or other organized dancing technique for people w/ tourettes, just move to the rhythm and let your tics become brilliant dance moves. Try juggling too. Meditation can also be effective. Try paying attention to your breathe instead of, let’s say, a TV, it’s just as entertaining and BREATHING is most people’s FAVORITE thing to do. Try paying attention to your attention towards things, watching yourself from the outside, like on a TV screen. Watch your self dance or stretch from the outside. Using this technique, it is possible to disassotiate your self from your body and your tics. Imagine your body just dissolving away. This is the objective of many drugs, but drugs are not neccesary to accomplish this. These things are way more fun than taking anti-psychotic, mind numbing, drugs too. And, of course, avoid a stressful lifestyle, tics are normal in everyone who’s stressed out. Yoga, exercise, dancing, juggling and things like that are great ways to relieve stress. Try mastering your body, it’s fun and will probably help your tics. Dan

Response:

‘Twas 5 Oct 2004 16:55:07 -0700 when all alt.support.tourette stood in awe as danl…@softhome.net (Dan) uttered:

I found that MINT helps my vocal tics and dense protien foods like meat make them worse.

Any meat?  I cut out phosphates a few years ago, and most preserved meat have phosphates.   — RB |  

Question:

Hi erin, I hope you are well. I appreciate your giving me the opportunity to help you. One of my life goals now that I have found my own peace of mind is to help others find theirs. Let me start by saying with all sincerity how much I admire your courage in seeking the answer to your anxiety challenge.  It’s people like you I want to help first since you’re already more than half-way there. You are an easier challenge because you’ve already shown me that you have decided not play the anxious victim anymore. That said let start by addressing the specific challenges you describe in your post:  hi,  i have been having anxiety on and off for over 10 years.  some times it is terrifying like i am going insane and sometimes it is just the pit feeling in my stomach and sweaty palms.

erin, believe me, I know first hand how terrifying anxiety can be. I have been a anxious, negative person for as long as I could remember. For the past 10 years, my panic attacks have been so severe that I have gone on stress leave three times. Back in January this year my level of anxiety levels had rose so high that I started to experience severe attacks to the point where I was becoming agoraphobic (actually too afraid to leave my apartment, for those of you new to alt.support.anxiety-panic). Let me tell you now erin, that after a decade of I have finally reached a state of pure peace of mind. the past week has been the worste, i have quit caffiene from drinking one espresso mocca a day and two diet cokes to cold turkey, i haven’t had headaches but my nerves have been on edge.

Your body is probably just reacting to its need for caffeine. Since you can’t tell for sure, take heart because it doesn’t matter. Just stick to your "no caffeine diet" and eventually your mind will realize that you’re serious and those nerves on the edge will give up and jump and leave you to enjoy your life. every time i talk i am anxious worrying how i said it and over analysying my words.  I haven’t done that before and i don’t know whsy so i feel like i am nuts.

Watch the words you choose. Imagine seeing yourself going into Starbucks. (I’m not sure where you live but since you have electricity, I’m pretty sure there’s a Starbucks near by since they are everywhere.) Now imagine you have just ordered a latte and the server brought you an espresso. Obviously he/she has simply made a mistake (let’s say you’re allergic to espressos), so you simply tell him that you had asked for a latte. The server tells you he/she’s sorry but adds that you did order a latte. Now what are you thinking. Has doubt crept in yet? Well let’s imagine that the customer behind you also says that you ordered an espresso. How’s your doubt level now, erin? Starting to wonder if it’s them who are feeling nuts and slowly Mr. Doubt is knocking at your door. Now let’s crank it up a notch and have your husband telling you that you did ask for a espresso. Suddenly you’re thinking you are nuts and you’re only going to welcome Mr. D in, you’re going to hand him the espresso and order the latte again. By point here is to always remember: "What we tell ourselves is what we believe." My first suggestion to you erin is to listen carefully to the thoughts you’re choosing to have. I haven’t done that before and i don’t know whsy so i feel like i am nuts.

What do you think you are telling yourself when you make comments like that? It’s no wonder that you’re anxious. You are conflicted because your negative self-destructive side is battling with your compassionate positive side. To make things harder for you, your negative words are giving your negative side more and more ammunition. What you need to do is find some WMC (weapons of mass creativity) and give your positive side a chance. I’ll give you some negative and more positive examples from your post. my work is very demanding."

How about "my work is very demanding but that’s OK because I really it. every time i talk i am anxious worrying how i said it and over analysying

my words. "Often when I talk." would probably closer to the truth because nobody does anything all the time not even breathing. my sister is in massachusetts and had a new baby i haven’t visited becasue

i am afraid to fly. Again, if you tell yourself that you are afraid to fly you will, simply because: "What we tell ourselves is what we believe." So here’s my offer. E-mail me directly and share with me one of your specific challenges. The flying to see your sister and her new baby would be my obvious chose, but I’d rather start with a smaller challenge and when we finish that one, we can take it from there. I hope this post offers you some help. I have no doubt that I can help you. In this last two weeks: 1.  My employer told me I have lost my job due to "restructuring" a choice that was made even though a month earlier they received the following e-mail from an employee in another office who took the time to write: I’m writing to express our sincere appreciation for the assistance received from Rick Lyons. It is working with individuals like Rick that further highlights the value of team work 2. My doctor tell me that I may have a life threatening illness. 3. I accidentally left my sunglasses in the cab one day. 4. I had to take my cat to the animal emergency clinic. 5. I accidentally lost several cheques written to me. Would any of the above cause you anxiety, Erin. Can you imagine how I felt? Of course you can (I’m sure your negative voice would love to start firing its arsenal at you should you experience similar events. Well, let me tell you that not one of the above cause me a moment’s stress. Not a moment. In fact, in examples 1. and 2. I felt the need to comfort the people who gave me the news because they were more stressed out then I was receiving it. I am telling you, Erin, I didn’t even break sweat facing these experiences. And it’s not because I live in Canada! :^) – I live in Vancouver and it hardly ever snows. Well that’s what I can offer. Send me a personal e-mail if you want more advice. Please remember to put ASAP in the subject line so I won’t mistake it or spam. By the way, I am honoured that you chose to address the post to me. I assure that I am ready to help I hope I can help get you to Massachusetts. Does that mean you are American or has the travelled to the US and you are wanting to visit her. I actually plan on flying down to Los Angeles later this month with a friend of mine and visiting Bob, my twin brother. Sometime in the beginning of August, Bob will be flying up here to Vancouver (he needs a break from his eight kids, I guess). We have decided to take a month off and drive across Canada and then come back through the good, ol’ US of A. I am really looking forward to the trip and getting to spend some quality time with him. One of my life goals is to visit Washington, DC. We plan on seeing the Smithsonian Institute, the Vietnam Veterans Wall, the White House, Lincoln’s memorial, etc. Bob wants to Dyersville, Iowa on the way back and see where the Field of Dreams movie was filled. Speaking of Bob, he’s actually just called me, so I’m going to close here. Take care, take control and have a great day and a really great life. Rick PS: I really have a lot on the go now, but I want to let you know that I am working on a new website to help all the people who come to visit it. Here’s the link: http://findpeaceofmind.ca/

Response:

so rick, what did you do to stop your anxiety? yoga, or something else

Response:

Hi erin, I did get into exercise (yoga, exercise at the gym, swimming) and that really helps the body (and the self-esteem). I also worked on the mind (meds and therapy). The trouble was that I followed these steps before (this was my third time on stress leave) and eventually I would think I was OK and the stress levels would rise and I would be back in the same boat all over again. I finally realized that if I continued to follow this pattern, I wouldn’t get the results I wanted. It’s like what I’ve wrote in previous posts: "If you repeat the same actions and expect different results, then you are setting yourself up for disappointment." So this time I took a closer look and discovered the right actions to take. I’ve posted some of them here, but I am still holding back on sharing my solution with anyone who wants to know. The reason I am not sharing my knowledge is because I want to make sure that while I have complete confidence that it works for me I want to test it to be sure I know the best way to make it help others. And I know it works, erin, because I have not felt a moment of anxiety (after more than 20+ years of panic attacks, nausea, agoraphobia, etc.), despite the fact that I’ve recently lost my job, been told by my doctor that I may have a life threatening illness, lost my sunglasses etc. (By the way, do you prefer erin as opposed to Erin.) Once I have ironed out the details, I will share my information on the website that I will be designing. Here is the link: www.findpeaceofmind.ca I will let ASAP know as soon as I’ve completed my test studies locally. Please understand I want to share my methods with you and everyone else as quickly as possible. When my website is up and running, I’ll provide the information for free because I am not looking to make any money off this. To do so would be to dishonour all of the people who come to ASAP seeking that are seeking help. So take a deep breath, keep visiting ASAP and know that you have met someone who has the answer you’ve been looking for. And it works without meds or hypnosis, I guarantee it. Rick in Vancouver PS: Where is erin/Erin? Somewhere in North or South Dakota?

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – so rick, what did you do to stop your anxiety? yoga, or something else

Response:

Hi, Erin, Anxiety can make you feel like you are going insane.  Fortunately, groups like this reassure us that we are not alone. Caffeine is a big trigger for my anxiety.  I drink lite coffee and it helps. Espresso makes me extremely anxious. Best wishes on starting your family.  Hopefully, you’ll get to see your sister’s baby soon. smiles, Elise

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – hi,  i have been having anxiety on and off for over 10 years.  some times it is terrifying like i am going insane and sometimes it is just the pit feeling in my stomach and sweaty palms. the past week has been the worste, i have quit caffiene from drinking one espresso mocca a day and two diet cokes to cold turkey, i haven’t had headaches but my nerves have been on edge. every time i talk i am anxious worrying how i said it and over analysying my words.  I haven’t done that before and i don’t know whsy so i feel like i am nuts. stressors……. my husband and i are going to try to have a baby starting in may, my work is very demanding I am a manager of a group home for people with developmental disablities, my father is in tonga in the peace corps,my sister is in massachusetts and had a new baby i haven’t visited becasue i am afraid to fly. i have thought of massage, yoga and hypnosis. what do you think. thanks. erin

Response:

hi i was just reading that pms,and caffiene with drawal will also cause anxiety symptoms.  I would like to not have the pit in my stomach and sweaty palms. why is it that what other people can just dismiss as mild anxiety I freak out about and obsess till it rules my life.  I have been feeling like this since last week, it could be pms then this thursday i stopped caffeiene and in feb was the last of the birth control pill so my body is probably wondering what is going on.  

Response:

hi,  i have been having anxiety on and off for over 10 years.  some times it is terrifying like i am going insane and sometimes it is just the pit feeling in my stomach and sweaty palms. the past week has been the worste, i have quit caffiene from drinking one espresso mocca a day and two diet cokes to cold turkey, i haven’t had headaches but my nerves have been on edge. every time i talk i am anxious worrying how i said it and over analysying my words.  I haven’t done that before and i don’t know whsy so i feel like i am nuts. stressors……. my husband and i are going to try to have a baby starting in may, my work is very demanding I am a manager of a group home for people with developmental disablities, my father is in tonga in the peace corps,my sister is in massachusetts and had a new baby i haven’t visited becasue i am afraid to fly. i have thought of massage, yoga and hypnosis. what do you think. thanks. erin  

Response:

Question:

Hi Marco, The Aussie show is Blue Heelers. Sorry but I don’t watch it. I will ask around about didgeridoo players. I have a friend with 9 didgeridoos:) The main aboriginal band that I like is Yothu Yindi. Sleeping at your friend’s house sounds a good idea. love Meryl

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey Meryl Enterprise is awesome, digital effect are pretty amazing, this new serie is started last month, the new one not the old with Spok I also like smallville, the tales of the teenage superman, I also seen days ago an australian tv serie, called blue steeler, or heeler I don’t remember but is about a police station Do you know something about it? Here the summer is really hot, I just came back from the public swimming pool but there was like 40 c

Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If yoga meant union  with ‘GOD’ then it would be called ‘yoga with God’ not just yoga.Also I’m saying that God exists as an concept but has no FORM of any sort.It’s an idea which is used metaphorically , not a literal live being we do yoga with.OM.rr Patanjali speaks of yoga in terms of istvara, the quality-less Person. Not sure what that means, but it sounds interesting… I always took the "union" part of yoga to mean obsorption into onself. Union of mind and body.

Patanjali makes reference to yoga in several different ways. Some hold that these refer to different perspectives about the same state, and others say that they’re references to different states. — New definition of irony: ‘Today’s liberal Democrats are like the supporters of the Third Reich of the ’30’s and ’40’s – they absolutely trusted the government to "make things right". ‘ -Comment made on the internet by an ardent GW Bush supporter.

Response:

If yoga meant union  with ‘GOD’ then it would be called ‘yoga with God’ not just yoga.Also I’m saying that God exists as an concept but has no FORM of any sort.It’s an idea which is used metaphorically , not a literal live being we do yoga with.OM.rr Patanjali speaks of yoga in terms of istvara, the quality-less Person. Not sure what that means, but it sounds interesting…

I always took the "union" part of yoga to mean obsorption into onself.   Union of mind and body.

Response:

If yoga meant union  with ‘GOD’ then it would be called ‘yoga with God’ not just yoga.Also I’m saying that God exists as an concept but has no FORM of any sort.It’s an idea which is used metaphorically , not a literal live being we do yoga with.OM.rr

Patanjali speaks of yoga in terms of istvara, the quality-less Person. Not sure what that means, but it sounds interesting… — New definition of irony: ‘Today’s liberal Democrats are like the supporters of the Third Reich of the ’30’s and ’40’s – they absolutely trusted the government to "make things right". ‘ -Comment made on the internet by an ardent GW Bush supporter.

Response:

If yoga meant union  with ‘GOD’ then it would be called ‘yoga with God’ not just yoga.Also I’m saying that God exists as an concept but has no FORM of any sort.It’s an idea which is used metaphorically , not a literal live being we do yoga with.OM.rr

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thats OK, it just means you do not know what yoga is. What else is new. Theres tons of other people that are clueless also. Why don’t you just form your own ’something’ and leave the word yoga out of it then? We have Tantric sex cults. Power Yoga exercise, Buddhists who are simply atheists. Why should you be any different? Do you listen to your stereo while you meditate? If someone hears, sees,smells,touches,etc, ‘GOD’ then it’s FOOLSgod in my opinion Ever seen an electron? Did you know your eyes can only see a teeny tiny part of the electromagnetic spectrum? Would you say ‘justice’ is ‘real?’ Ever seen one walking around? Do they grow on trees? How about ‘one?’ I thought I saw one (pun intended) sneaking around my trash can last night while the dog was barking. As ususal, I think he got away with his counterpart in crime – ‘two.’ Time for a little fun. Who are you? Think you can answer that ‘one’ simple question for me? (I would ask you what you think of quantum theory and The Holographic Universe or Hyperspace, but my guess is thats out…..). Omjaroo go ahead/Hittleman smoke and mirrors. Mike Dubbeld Yoga is spiritual union.Union of all, not union with anything including ‘GOD’ or gods I think.I don’t like even mentioning ‘GOD’ when talking about yoga. To me  the western ‘GOD’ is a spiritual blackhole that sucks in most of the meaning. Spiritual sustenance is everywhere.When it’s realized that the concept of  God is a metaphor of spiritual meaning then the pull of gravity diminishes.Some take ‘GOD’ so literally that they think it’s ‘GOD’ giving them advice by personally[or Jesus] speaking to them,etc.If someone hears, sees,smells,touches,etc, ‘GOD’ then it’s FOOLSgod in my opinion.OM, rr

Response:

Thats OK, it just means you do not know what yoga is. What else is new. Theres tons of other people that are clueless also. Why don’t you just form your own ’something’ and leave the word yoga out of it then? We have Tantric sex cults. Power Yoga exercise, Buddhists who are simply atheists. Why should you be any different? Do you listen to your stereo while you meditate? If someone hears, sees,smells,touches,etc, ‘GOD’ then it’s FOOLSgod in my opinion

Ever seen an electron? Did you know your eyes can only see a teeny tiny part of the electromagnetic spectrum? Would you say ‘justice’ is ‘real?’ Ever seen one walking around? Do they grow on trees? How about ‘one?’ I thought I saw one (pun intended) sneaking around my trash can last night while the dog was barking. As ususal, I think he got away with his counterpart in crime – ‘two.’ Time for a little fun. Who are you? Think you can answer that ‘one’ simple question for me? (I would ask you what you think of quantum theory and The Holographic Universe or Hyperspace, but my guess is thats out…..). Omjaroo go ahead/Hittleman smoke and mirrors. Mike Dubbeld

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yoga is spiritual union.Union of all, not union with anything including ‘GOD’ or gods I think.I don’t like even mentioning ‘GOD’ when talking about yoga. To me  the western ‘GOD’ is a spiritual blackhole that sucks in most of the meaning. Spiritual sustenance is everywhere.When it’s realized that the concept of  God is a metaphor of spiritual meaning then the pull of gravity diminishes.Some take ‘GOD’ so literally that they think it’s ‘GOD’ giving them advice by personally[or Jesus] speaking to them,etc.If someone hears, sees,smells,touches,etc, ‘GOD’ then it’s FOOLSgod in my opinion.OM, rr

Response:

Yoga is spiritual union.Union of all, not union with anything including ‘GOD’ or gods I think.I don’t like even mentioning ‘GOD’ when talking about yoga. To me  the western ‘GOD’ is a spiritual blackhole that sucks in most of the meaning. Spiritual sustenance is everywhere.When it’s realized that the concept of  God is a metaphor of spiritual meaning then the pull of gravity diminishes.Some take ‘GOD’ so literally that they think it’s ‘GOD’ giving them advice by personally[or Jesus] speaking to them,etc.If someone hears, sees,smells,touches,etc, ‘GOD’ then it’s FOOLSgod in my opinion.OM, rr

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Question:

Hi, I suffer with arthritis in my knees and back.  I found a great yoga exercise video on the net.  I modify some of the routines such as doing some of the standing poses while lying down.  It gives me great relief and I have begun feeling stronger and have more stamina after only a few sessions.  The instructor (Jacque Davis) even offers a free consultation via e-mail when you purchase.  The consultation was not advertised on the site, so you can imagine how surprised I was when she contacted me by e-mail.  She has a very impressive list of clients and have been teaching yoga for over 20 years. It’s not an expensive program, you can find it here: http://www.yogabyjacquidavis.com

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi! My gym has a Gentle Yoga program once a week. I’ve found that it really helps some of the pain I have as well as helps my stress level. I would like to do Yoga more then just once a week but don’t have money to go and find a yoga instructor or school. I’d like to do it at home when it gets particularly painful or stressful. I’m in a high stress environment almost contantly daily. I’m looking for someone who might have a sample yoga program that I can do at home. I’ve taken enough classes to know that the movements need to flow into each other and I think that I can do that. I understand I might not know all the poses you provide but am fluent in "web" so I won’t have any problem finding the poses and how to do them on the web. If ANYONE can help me that would be wonderful. If it’s a 10 or 15 min program fine. If you have one longer..that’s good to. I just desperately need this to remain sane. Thanks for your help. Kimi

Response:

Hi, It’s best to get a book cause the book will tell things like if you have a heart problem not to stand on your head or whatever. Besides books are cheap. Instead of more at home on a break at work try streching like raising your arms over your head. Bend down at the waist. It only takes a minute. But for stress I know one thing that basically can’t be beat. Breathe in saying om om om om om then out om om om om om. Same number of counts in as out. This literally gives you a charge because normal breathing is a shorter in and longer out ratio. Try and find what your count is. May not like 5 in 5 out. Change it as you go 20-30 times if need be over an hour. The count is not particularly important but you should find one and stick to as best as possible. This technique can basically be shockingly successful. Not only will you be so much more composed – the people around you may clearly be wonderous at your composure. You will find yourself thinking and moving in time to your count. Every time you start to do it your mind will rebel. But after 30 minutes you likely will not really want to stop. Don’t go for more than a couple of hours each day for the first week. Speech carries prana. This technique will also cause your voice to become sweet and melodious. Others may thrill to hear your voice. Like a glass that overflows with water when you try to put too much in, prana from you will spill over from you in your voice and exit your senses also. You can actually give someone a lift simply by looking at them. The more purified your nadis are the more charge you can store/successful you will be. If you use this for nothing else – use it before the most stressful events like an interview or test or find yourself in a waiting room with a bunch of nervous people. Rhythmic breathing is a tool to control the mind. Kundalini Yoga teaches a ‘Breath of Fire’ break which is kapalabhati and they usually go for 3 minutes. However I don’t recommend combinding them and of the 2 the rhythimc breathing is a lot more beneficial. Don’t get carried away with rhythmic breathing. There are lots of mystical techniques that assist in controlling the mind as well. Mike Dubbeld

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi! My gym has a Gentle Yoga program once a week. I’ve found that it really helps some of the pain I have as well as helps my stress level. I would like to do Yoga more then just once a week but don’t have money to go and find a yoga instructor or school. I’d like to do it at home when it gets particularly painful or stressful. I’m in a high stress environment almost contantly daily. I’m looking for someone who might have a sample yoga program that I can do at home. I’ve taken enough classes to know that the movements need to flow into each other and I think that I can do that. I understand I might not know all the poses you provide but am fluent in "web" so I won’t have any problem finding the poses and how to do them on the web. If ANYONE can help me that would be wonderful. If it’s a 10 or 15 min program fine. If you have one longer..that’s good to. I just desperately need this to remain sane. Thanks for your help. Kimi

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would like to do Yoga more then just once a week but don’t have money to go and find a yoga instructor or school. I’m sure people will recommend tons of books and videos that you might use. I’ve heard that most are very good.  And I think reading is one of the best ways to learn about anything.  Most major book stores have whole shelves devoted to yoga. My suggestion, however, is that you repeat whatever you have done in class. Use the same sequences and just try to repeat at least part of your class as much as you can.  It might help you to take a little notebook to class and immediately after class write down either what you remember or what you want to remember to work on later. Unless you are using a style that has a prescribed sequence, you will evolve your own program. Gary Echternacht

I agree with these suggestions.  I’ve been doing all of them too!  (Except the notebook stays at home on the dresser ; ) Amy

Response:

Hi! My gym has a Gentle Yoga program once a week. I’ve found that it really helps some of the pain I have as well as helps my stress level. I would like to do Yoga more then just once a week but don’t have money to go and find a yoga instructor or school. I’d like to do it at home when it gets particularly painful or stressful. I’m in a high stress environment almost contantly daily. I’m looking for someone who might have a sample yoga program that I can do at home. I’ve taken enough classes to know that the movements need to flow into each other and I think that I can do that. I understand I might not know all the poses you provide but am fluent in "web" so I won’t have any problem finding the poses and how to do them on the web. If ANYONE can help me that would be wonderful. If it’s a 10 or 15 min program fine. If you have one longer..that’s good to. I just desperately need this to remain sane. Thanks for your help. Kimi

Response:

I would like to do Yoga more then just once a week but don’t have money to go and find a yoga instructor or school.

I’m sure people will recommend tons of books and videos that you might use. I’ve heard that most are very good.  And I think reading is one of the best ways to learn about anything.  Most major book stores have whole shelves devoted to yoga. My suggestion, however, is that you repeat whatever you have done in class. Use the same sequences and just try to repeat at least part of your class as much as you can.  It might help you to take a little notebook to class and immediately after class write down either what you remember or what you want to remember to work on later. Unless you are using a style that has a prescribed sequence, you will evolve your own program. Gary Echternacht

Response:

Question:

kay what you said reminded me of a good story , I was running the Cowtown marathon when Keri(a tri) ran by me. A cyclist was just about 2 feet behind her. The course turn right (she turned) .The cyclist (swears he was only wathing her form aka style of running)not seeing the pot hole in his path went over the bars and got a case of road rash. Thank goodness i was just watching the scene. It would have been more sad if it was not so funny. She did not see any of this just kept right on running=)) plodzilla

Well, I had to check with the guy but he said I can post this – he views it as his penance I think – one of my two running clients has been taking his stretching very seriously since we began working on it and was doing very well until a week ago when he was runnning on Brighton seafront, stopped to do his post run stretching, saw a beautiful girl walking towards him … she actually stopped and asked him whether he was training for the London marathon, he replied while casually lifting his right foot to his buttock for his quads stretch and overstretched by quite a bit, trying to look good so … he got cramp, fell to the ground and misplaced the cartilage in his nose! The girl asked if he was OK, he said fine, she walked on and he ended up in the minor injuries unit having his nose strapped! Kay

Response:

i am laughing so hard i fell out of my chair=)) plodzilla – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – kay what you said reminded me of a good story , I was running the Cowtown marathon when Keri(a tri) ran by me. A cyclist was just about 2 feet behind her. The course turn right (she turned) .The cyclist (swears he was only wathing her form aka style of running)not seeing the pot hole in his path went over the bars and got a case of road rash. Thank goodness i was just watching the scene. It would have been more sad if it was not so funny. She did not see any of this just kept right on running=)) plodzilla Well, I had to check with the guy but he said I can post this – he views it as his penance I think – one of my two running clients has been taking his stretching very seriously since we began working on it and was doing very well until a week ago when he was runnning on Brighton seafront, stopped to do his post run stretching, saw a beautiful girl walking towards him … she actually stopped and asked him whether he was training for the London marathon, he replied while casually lifting his right foot to his buttock for his quads stretch and overstretched by quite a bit, trying to look good so … he got cramp, fell to the ground and misplaced the cartilage in his nose! The girl asked if he was OK, he said fine, she walked on and he ended up in the minor injuries unit having his nose strapped! Kay

Response:

  Thanks much for all the advice. I will check out these sources. Skip

Response:

Howdy folks,   I’ve been following this newsgroup for about 4 weeks, and have gleaned lots of useful information. Now I have a specific question.   I’m 53 years old and training for my first marathon. I would like to incorporate stretching into my training. Can anyone recommend  any websites or books on stretching that are designed for runners? Skip

good book: Stretching/Bob Anderson

Response:

 I’m 53 years old and training for my first marathon. I would like to incorporate stretching into my training. Can anyone recommend  any websites or books on stretching that are designed for runners?

The Illustrated Guide to Yoga by Swami Vishnu-Devananda.  There are numerous training schedules in the appendix geared for all conditions and ages, for getting into Yoga. Yoga exercise supercedes stretching exercises; runners, otherwise; and actually pushes up the cardio vascular and respiratory efficiency quite a bit.  One round even of a set of gentle exercises feels just like running a mile … at a sub 6 minute pace.  But calling the Bow or Peacock "gentle" would be ironic.

Response:

 I’m 53 years old and training for my first marathon. I would like to incorporate stretching into my training. Can anyone recommend  any websites or books on stretching that are designed for runners?

To follow up on my comment, it’s also worth pointing out that all runner’s stretches are also well-known Yoga poses, or minor variations or reduced versions thereof; but only a small subset thereof.  So, it’s best to learn and practice it from the source, itself, instead of as hand-me-down knowledge.

Response:

kay what you said reminded me of a good story , I was running the Cowtown marathon when Keri(a tri) ran by me. A cyclist was just about 2 feet behind her. The course turn right (she turned) .The cyclist (swears he was only wathing her form aka style of running)not seeing the pot hole in his path went over the bars and got a case of road rash. Thank goodness i was just watching the scene. It would have been more sad if it was not so funny. She did not see any of this just kept right on running=)) plodzilla – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Howdy folks,   I’ve been following this newsgroup for about 4 weeks, and have gleaned lots of useful information. Now I have a specific question.   I’m 53 years old and training for my first marathon. I would like to incorporate stretching into my training. Can anyone recommend  any websites or books on stretching that are designed for runners? Hi Skip There are many basic stretching routines, several of which are runner specific, and there is good stretching info in the FAQ for r.r.  If you have a specific muscle group that you want to work on, or a certain style problem you think can be corrected by muscular mobility, there are several people here who can advise – but they’d need more information to be able to help. Things NOT to do are: –don’t stretch cold – do a short, leisurely and simple warm up to soften the muscles and get the blood moving –don’t bounce – ballistic stretching (bouncing) is worse for many people than no stretching –don’t feel self conscious if you stretch in public – trying to touch your toes just because a cute person may be watching probably causes a lot of slipped discs! And try to enjoy it … stretching can be fun! Kay

Response:

Hi Skip, Try this site. http://www.row2k.com/physio/overview.html I’ve been doing the Hamstrings, Iliotibial Band, Lateral Hip, & Lumbar Paraspinals, Psoas (hip flexors), Thoracic, Lumbar Paraspinals, Lateral Rotators of the Hip, and Ribs, since last November to prepare for the Tucson Marathon I ran in December. The excersizes helped tremendously! I visited a neuro-muscular therapist who is also a marathon runner and he advised me to do the excersizes mentioned above. I just stumbled onto the web site and there was helpful information on them. BoB

Response:

Re:  original question about hip flexor stretch w/o putting a load on an injured knee. Usu. one would do a lunge.  In yoga poses, the Warrior I, II and III, as well as other standing poses. These do load the knee, however. One solution:  do the pose under a bar placed at a height at which you can reduce the load on your knee by pulling on the bar with your raised arms. There is an extremely effective partner/therapist assisted stretch for the psoas using a table or bench, that would be easy on the knees. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Skip, Try this site. http://www.row2k.com/physio/overview.html I’ve been doing the Hamstrings, Iliotibial Band, Lateral Hip, & Lumbar Paraspinals, Psoas (hip flexors), Thoracic, Lumbar Paraspinals, Lateral Rotators of the Hip, and Ribs, since last November to prepare for the Tucson Marathon I ran in December. The excersizes helped tremendously! I visited a neuro-muscular therapist who is also a marathon runner and he advised me to do the excersizes mentioned above. I just stumbled onto the web site and there was helpful information on them. BoB

Response:

Howdy folks,   I’ve been following this newsgroup for about 4 weeks, and have gleaned lots of useful information. Now I have a specific question.   I’m 53 years old and training for my first marathon. I would like to incorporate stretching into my training. Can anyone recommend  any websites or books on stretching that are designed for runners?

Hi Skip There are many basic stretching routines, several of which are runner specific, and there is good stretching info in the FAQ for r.r.  If you have a specific muscle group that you want to work on, or a certain style problem you think can be corrected by muscular mobility, there are several people here who can advise – but they’d need more information to be able to help. Things NOT to do are: –don’t stretch cold – do a short, leisurely and simple warm up to soften the muscles and get the blood moving –don’t bounce – ballistic stretching (bouncing) is worse for many people than no stretching –don’t feel self conscious if you stretch in public – trying to touch your toes just because a cute person may be watching probably causes a lot of slipped discs! And try to enjoy it … stretching can be fun! Kay

Response:

Howdy folks,   I’ve been following this newsgroup for about 4 weeks, and have gleaned lots of useful information. Now I have a specific question.   I’m 53 years old and training for my first marathon. I would like to incorporate stretching into my training. Can anyone recommend  any websites or books on stretching that are designed for runners? Skip

Response:

Please go through the rec.running FAQ part 8 of 8. It can be found at http://www.faqs.org/faqs/running-faq/part8/ It has a wealth of information about web sites and organizations affiliated with running. Shravan

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Howdy folks,   I’ve been following this newsgroup for about 4 weeks, and have gleaned lots of useful information. Now I have a specific question.   I’m 53 years old and training for my first marathon. I would like to incorporate stretching into my training. Can anyone recommend  any websites or books on stretching that are designed for runners? Skip

Response:

Question:

running & 120 mg of prozac every day will keep the blues away http://community.webtv.net/ultrajohn1/dummyup http://community.webtv.net/ultrajohn1/talkischeapliesr http://community.webtv.net/ultrajohn1/splat http://community.webtv.net/ultrajohn1/hiitssarahtime http://community.webtv.net/ultrajohn1/Iwasborntorun http://community.webtv.net/ultrajohn1/welcum

Response:

[[ This message was both posted and mailed: see    the "To," "Cc," and "Newsgroups" headers for details. ]] – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks John and everyone else who was kind enough to post their experiences  of running and depression/anxiety.  It helps in so many ways to know  that there are others who are using running as a treatment or adjunct treatment to these oh so human of conditions I see that a number of people have presented anecdotal evidence of the benefits of exercise (specifically running) in the treatment of depression. As a grad student I worked on a number of projects which examined this very topic.  The prof I was working with had recently published a meta-analysis that suggests that exercise is as effective in treating clinical depression as psychotherapy or psychopharmacology.  Exercise combined with psychotherapy was found to be the most effective treatment.  The meta also found that exercise was effective at treating all times of depression (mild, moderate, and severe) and the greatest reductions were seen in those that were the most depressed at baseline (which is logical).  I saw another study (not sure if it is published yet), that compared exercise to Zoloft and found that Zoloft was more effective at reducing depression at 4 weeks, exercise and Zoloft were equal at 8 weeks, and exercise was more effective at 12 weeks. — Jeremy Pomeroy http://www.home.earthlink.net/~azmtbr/ http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/teamadventureracing "mens sana in corpore sano"

Jeremy, Would  you cite the location of the meta-analysis on exercise as a treatment for cliical depression. Many thanks, Ozzie Gontang

Response:

Mike, Around the beginning of June I had an anxiety attack ( after the last few years of too much beer and too many smokes). The doctors gave me Valium, Xanax and tried to put me on   Zoloft.  Not being inclined to solve problems with drugs , I joined a local running club.  I refused the drugs ( except a week or two of valium) and turned things around. I finished my first marathon ( ok..it was 5 hours) and have signed up for a local Triathlon in April ( St anthony’s).  Chemical imbalances are a major cause of most anxiety/depression related illness and these CAN be altered with diet/exercise.  I firmly believe that Dr,’s spend WAY to much time prescribing and not enough time trying to change the diet and excercise patterns of their patients.   Here is a Cut and Paste from WebMD on anxiety: "Healthy Lifestyle A healthy lifestyle that includes exercise, adequate rest, and good nutrition can help to reduce the impact of anxiety attacks. Rhythmic aerobic and yoga exercise programs lasting for more than 15 weeks have been found to help reduce anxiety. Strength, or resistance training does not seem to help anxiety." John – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life. Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for depression/anxiety.? Thanks, Mike

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Mike, Around the beginning of June I had an anxiety attack ( after the last few years of too much beer and too many smokes). The doctors gave me Valium, Xanax and tried to put me on   Zoloft.  Not being inclined to solve problems with drugs , I joined a local running club.  I refused the drugs ( except a week or two of valium) and turned things around. I finished my first marathon ( ok..it was 5 hours) and have signed up for a local Triathlon in April ( St anthony’s).  Chemical imbalances are a major cause of most anxiety/depression related illness and these CAN be altered with diet/exercise.  I firmly believe that Dr,’s spend WAY to much time prescribing and not enough time trying to change the diet and excercise patterns of their patients.   Here is a Cut and Paste from WebMD on anxiety: "Healthy Lifestyle A healthy lifestyle that includes exercise, adequate rest, and good nutrition can help to reduce the impact of anxiety attacks. Rhythmic aerobic and yoga exercise programs lasting for more than 15 weeks have been found to help reduce anxiety. Strength, or resistance training does not seem to help anxiety." John I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life. Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for depression/anxiety.? Thanks, Mike

Thanks John and everyone else who was kind enough to post their experiences  of running and depression/anxiety.  It helps in so many ways to know  that there are others who are using running as a treatment or adjunct treatment to these oh so human of conditions

Response:

My situation is similar to Cam’s. After a very tough, messy beakup with my live-in girlfriend of five years, I moped horribly for an entire year, became clinically depressed, and then decided to dig myself out of the hole. I quit smoking and started running the next day. I have never looked back since.

oh c’mon, David… I’ll bet you HAVE looked back, like at that guy in second place when you won that race recently!  :) it’s too bad that many of us must hit (nearly) rock bottom before making a major *positive* life change. but i guess this is what makes life interesting. Cam

Response:

My wife wrote her MS thesis on excercise and depression, so we (uh, she) have read quite a bit on the subject. Therefore, we have a pretty extensive reference section should someone be interested. There is quatifiable evidence that exercise helps to a certain point, however there can be tendency for higher level athletes to potentially suffer from more symptoms of depression in certain situations. Well, that last statement is an oversimplification, but I don’t want to bore anyone.

Response:

We dont need any more people who are excited about life.  Thanks anyway.

Response:

Thanks John and everyone else who was kind enough to post their experiences  of running and depression/anxiety.  It helps in so many ways to know  that there are others who are using running as a treatment or adjunct treatment to these oh so human of conditions

I see that a number of people have presented anecdotal evidence of the benefits of exercise (specifically running) in the treatment of depression. As a grad student I worked on a number of projects which examined this very topic.  The prof I was working with had recently published a meta-analysis that suggests that exercise is as effective in treating clinical depression as psychotherapy or psychopharmacology.  Exercise combined with psychotherapy was found to be the most effective treatment.  The meta also found that exercise was effective at treating all times of depression (mild, moderate, and severe) and the greatest reductions were seen in those that were the most depressed at baseline (which is logical).  I saw another study (not sure if it is published yet), that compared exercise to Zoloft and found that Zoloft was more effective at reducing depression at 4 weeks, exercise and Zoloft were equal at 8 weeks, and exercise was more effective at 12 weeks. — Jeremy Pomeroy http://www.home.earthlink.net/~azmtbr/ http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/teamadventureracing "mens sana in corpore sano"

Response:

in the movie ’storm and sorrow’ a climber after seeing 3 teams of climbing die one way or another, states "i can always go back to climbing" I feel that way when it just hits the fan . A fortress of solitude (not loneliness mind you) my asics aford me  as i propel down the road. plodzilla – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life. Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for depression/anxiety.? Thanks, Mike

Response:

I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life. Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for depression/anxiety.?

I can’t speak about depression but I did run for stress control and it was VERY effective. I was always a morning runner and go to work feeling very calm and the usual anxiety driven demands seemed less daunting. I could not begin to guess how much it would help general depression but I’ll bet it does little harm. — Caveat Lector "the further you go outside, the further you go inside" – B. McKibben Doug Freese

Response:

I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life.

Agreed! Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for depression/anxiety.?

While running has always been part of my life, the amount and frequency have varied, and usually related to how I’ve felt. During times of high stress (working on my dissertation for instance) I was running 8 miles every other day, now I’m down to 3 miles 3 or 4 times a week, but that’s changing once again. Running for me is my main antidode to feeling sad/depressed or stressed. It’s hard not to feel better after a run. Esmail — 32N 83W                                      http://www.cs.mercer.edu/bonak

Response:

My situation is similar to Cam’s. After a very tough, messy beakup with my live-in girlfriend of five years, I moped horribly for an entire year, became clinically depressed, and then decided to dig myself out of the hole. I quit smoking and started running the next day. I have never looked back since. — David (in Hamilton, Ont) "You never conquer a mountain. You stand on the summit a few moments; and then the wind blows your footprints away."                                          Arlene Blum, Annapurna http://www.angelfire.com/nc/swstudio/home.html – – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life. Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for depression/anxiety.? Thanks, Mike Yes, Mike…. running has got to be the best medication for low to moderate depression. I think that some people may need the medication if they have extreme depression, but I know from experience that running can lift a person (who likes this activity, of course) out of the doldrums. Five years ago, I began to go through the first stages of a marital separation. Not a good time. I was not a terribly active person at the time, but I recognized the fact that I needed a healthy outlet. I tried out kung fu, tai chi, some weights, and even though these made me feel great for a while, my interest in each of them waned. When I stumbled upon running, it was a godsend. A daily dose of the great outdoors, fresh air, exercise – all leading to racing and training. I’d say that if you enjoy running – for whatever reason – do it, and you will feel better. But if it becomes obsessive to the point of overtraining, or if it interferes with other aspects of your life,  then it would be time to reassess why you are doing it. Best of luck, Cam

Response:

I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life. Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for depression/anxiety.? Thanks, Mike

Yes, Mike…. running has got to be the best medication for low to moderate depression. I think that some people may need the medication if they have extreme depression, but I know from experience that running can lift a person (who likes this activity, of course) out of the doldrums. Five years ago, I began to go through the first stages of a marital separation. Not a good time. I was not a terribly active person at the time, but I recognized the fact that I needed a healthy outlet. I tried out kung fu, tai chi, some weights, and even though these made me feel great for a while, my interest in each of them waned. When I stumbled upon running, it was a godsend. A daily dose of the great outdoors, fresh air, exercise – all leading to racing and training. I’d say that if you enjoy running – for whatever reason – do it, and you will feel better. But if it becomes obsessive to the point of overtraining, or if it interferes with other aspects of your life,  then it would be time to reassess why you are doing it. Best of luck, Cam

Response:

You just have to look at an injured runner, you will see mood change and the feeling that something is missing. Even if croos-training is involve+ADs- it is not the same high as only running can provide. When you have been a runner for 20 years, this habit of mood elevation is a must. Dan Mike a +AOk-crit dans le message … +AD4-I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am +AD4-hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. +AD4-Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life. +AD4- +AD4-Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for +AD4-depression/anxiety.? +AD4-Thanks, +AD4- +AD4-Mike

Response:

I’ve been a runner since 1978.  I recall vaguely a study, probably 15 to 20 years ago, in which a group of patients with depression etc were separated into 2 groups.  One group received traditional psychiatric therapy, the other group was put on a running program.  At the conclusion of the test each group was evaluated for progress.  The evaluator could detect no significant differences between the groups.  The running group improved at the same rate as the therapy group. I’m not surprised.  I believe strongly that running helped me to maintain my sanity during a divorce.  It’s hard to feel bad after a good run. Michael

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You just have to look at an injured runner, you will see mood change and the feeling that something is missing. Even if croos-training is involve+ADs- it is not the same high as only running can provide. When you have been a runner for 20 years, this habit of mood elevation is a must. Dan Mike a +AOk-crit dans le message … +AD4-I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am +AD4-hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. +AD4-Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life. +AD4- +AD4-Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for +AD4-depression/anxiety.? +AD4-Thanks, +AD4- +AD4-Mike

Response:

I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life. Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for depression/anxiety.? Thanks, Mike

Response:

Question:

We dont need any more people who are excited about life.  Thanks anyway.

Response:

Thanks John and everyone else who was kind enough to post their experiences  of running and depression/anxiety.  It helps in so many ways to know  that there are others who are using running as a treatment or adjunct treatment to these oh so human of conditions

I see that a number of people have presented anecdotal evidence of the benefits of exercise (specifically running) in the treatment of depression. As a grad student I worked on a number of projects which examined this very topic.  The prof I was working with had recently published a meta-analysis that suggests that exercise is as effective in treating clinical depression as psychotherapy or psychopharmacology.  Exercise combined with psychotherapy was found to be the most effective treatment.  The meta also found that exercise was effective at treating all times of depression (mild, moderate, and severe) and the greatest reductions were seen in those that were the most depressed at baseline (which is logical).  I saw another study (not sure if it is published yet), that compared exercise to Zoloft and found that Zoloft was more effective at reducing depression at 4 weeks, exercise and Zoloft were equal at 8 weeks, and exercise was more effective at 12 weeks. — Jeremy Pomeroy http://www.home.earthlink.net/~azmtbr/ http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/teamadventureracing "mens sana in corpore sano"

Response:

[[ This message was both posted and mailed: see    the "To," "Cc," and "Newsgroups" headers for details. ]] – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks John and everyone else who was kind enough to post their experiences  of running and depression/anxiety.  It helps in so many ways to know  that there are others who are using running as a treatment or adjunct treatment to these oh so human of conditions I see that a number of people have presented anecdotal evidence of the benefits of exercise (specifically running) in the treatment of depression. As a grad student I worked on a number of projects which examined this very topic.  The prof I was working with had recently published a meta-analysis that suggests that exercise is as effective in treating clinical depression as psychotherapy or psychopharmacology.  Exercise combined with psychotherapy was found to be the most effective treatment.  The meta also found that exercise was effective at treating all times of depression (mild, moderate, and severe) and the greatest reductions were seen in those that were the most depressed at baseline (which is logical).  I saw another study (not sure if it is published yet), that compared exercise to Zoloft and found that Zoloft was more effective at reducing depression at 4 weeks, exercise and Zoloft were equal at 8 weeks, and exercise was more effective at 12 weeks. — Jeremy Pomeroy http://www.home.earthlink.net/~azmtbr/ http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/teamadventureracing "mens sana in corpore sano"

Jeremy, Would  you cite the location of the meta-analysis on exercise as a treatment for cliical depression. Many thanks, Ozzie Gontang

Response:

running & 120 mg of prozac every day will keep the blues away http://community.webtv.net/ultrajohn1/dummyup http://community.webtv.net/ultrajohn1/talkischeapliesr http://community.webtv.net/ultrajohn1/splat http://community.webtv.net/ultrajohn1/hiitssarahtime http://community.webtv.net/ultrajohn1/Iwasborntorun http://community.webtv.net/ultrajohn1/welcum

Response:

My wife wrote her MS thesis on excercise and depression, so we (uh, she) have read quite a bit on the subject. Therefore, we have a pretty extensive reference section should someone be interested. There is quatifiable evidence that exercise helps to a certain point, however there can be tendency for higher level athletes to potentially suffer from more symptoms of depression in certain situations. Well, that last statement is an oversimplification, but I don’t want to bore anyone.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Mike, Around the beginning of June I had an anxiety attack ( after the last few years of too much beer and too many smokes). The doctors gave me Valium, Xanax and tried to put me on   Zoloft.  Not being inclined to solve problems with drugs , I joined a local running club.  I refused the drugs ( except a week or two of valium) and turned things around. I finished my first marathon ( ok..it was 5 hours) and have signed up for a local Triathlon in April ( St anthony’s).  Chemical imbalances are a major cause of most anxiety/depression related illness and these CAN be altered with diet/exercise.  I firmly believe that Dr,’s spend WAY to much time prescribing and not enough time trying to change the diet and excercise patterns of their patients.   Here is a Cut and Paste from WebMD on anxiety: "Healthy Lifestyle A healthy lifestyle that includes exercise, adequate rest, and good nutrition can help to reduce the impact of anxiety attacks. Rhythmic aerobic and yoga exercise programs lasting for more than 15 weeks have been found to help reduce anxiety. Strength, or resistance training does not seem to help anxiety." John I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life. Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for depression/anxiety.? Thanks, Mike

Thanks John and everyone else who was kind enough to post their experiences  of running and depression/anxiety.  It helps in so many ways to know  that there are others who are using running as a treatment or adjunct treatment to these oh so human of conditions

Response:

My situation is similar to Cam’s. After a very tough, messy beakup with my live-in girlfriend of five years, I moped horribly for an entire year, became clinically depressed, and then decided to dig myself out of the hole. I quit smoking and started running the next day. I have never looked back since.

oh c’mon, David… I’ll bet you HAVE looked back, like at that guy in second place when you won that race recently!  :) it’s too bad that many of us must hit (nearly) rock bottom before making a major *positive* life change. but i guess this is what makes life interesting. Cam

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Mike, Around the beginning of June I had an anxiety attack ( after the last few years of too much beer and too many smokes). The doctors gave me Valium, Xanax and tried to put me on   Zoloft.  Not being inclined to solve problems with drugs , I joined a local running club.  I refused the drugs ( except a week or two of valium) and turned things around. I finished my first marathon ( ok..it was 5 hours) and have signed up for a local Triathlon in April ( St anthony’s).  Chemical imbalances are a major cause of most anxiety/depression related illness and these CAN be altered with diet/exercise.  I firmly believe that Dr,’s spend WAY to much time prescribing and not enough time trying to change the diet and excercise patterns of their patients.   Here is a Cut and Paste from WebMD on anxiety: "Healthy Lifestyle A healthy lifestyle that includes exercise, adequate rest, and good nutrition can help to reduce the impact of anxiety attacks. Rhythmic aerobic and yoga exercise programs lasting for more than 15 weeks have been found to help reduce anxiety. Strength, or resistance training does not seem to help anxiety." John – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life. Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for depression/anxiety.? Thanks, Mike

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My situation is similar to Cam’s. After a very tough, messy beakup with my live-in girlfriend of five years, I moped horribly for an entire year, became clinically depressed, and then decided to dig myself out of the hole. I quit smoking and started running the next day. I have never looked back since. — David (in Hamilton, Ont) "You never conquer a mountain. You stand on the summit a few moments; and then the wind blows your footprints away."                                          Arlene Blum, Annapurna http://www.angelfire.com/nc/swstudio/home.html – – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life. Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for depression/anxiety.? Thanks, Mike Yes, Mike…. running has got to be the best medication for low to moderate depression. I think that some people may need the medication if they have extreme depression, but I know from experience that running can lift a person (who likes this activity, of course) out of the doldrums. Five years ago, I began to go through the first stages of a marital separation. Not a good time. I was not a terribly active person at the time, but I recognized the fact that I needed a healthy outlet. I tried out kung fu, tai chi, some weights, and even though these made me feel great for a while, my interest in each of them waned. When I stumbled upon running, it was a godsend. A daily dose of the great outdoors, fresh air, exercise – all leading to racing and training. I’d say that if you enjoy running – for whatever reason – do it, and you will feel better. But if it becomes obsessive to the point of overtraining, or if it interferes with other aspects of your life,  then it would be time to reassess why you are doing it. Best of luck, Cam

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in the movie ’storm and sorrow’ a climber after seeing 3 teams of climbing die one way or another, states "i can always go back to climbing" I feel that way when it just hits the fan . A fortress of solitude (not loneliness mind you) my asics aford me  as i propel down the road. plodzilla – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life. Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for depression/anxiety.? Thanks, Mike

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I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life. Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for depression/anxiety.? Thanks, Mike

Yes, Mike…. running has got to be the best medication for low to moderate depression. I think that some people may need the medication if they have extreme depression, but I know from experience that running can lift a person (who likes this activity, of course) out of the doldrums. Five years ago, I began to go through the first stages of a marital separation. Not a good time. I was not a terribly active person at the time, but I recognized the fact that I needed a healthy outlet. I tried out kung fu, tai chi, some weights, and even though these made me feel great for a while, my interest in each of them waned. When I stumbled upon running, it was a godsend. A daily dose of the great outdoors, fresh air, exercise – all leading to racing and training. I’d say that if you enjoy running – for whatever reason – do it, and you will feel better. But if it becomes obsessive to the point of overtraining, or if it interferes with other aspects of your life,  then it would be time to reassess why you are doing it. Best of luck, Cam

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I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life.

Agreed! Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for depression/anxiety.?

While running has always been part of my life, the amount and frequency have varied, and usually related to how I’ve felt. During times of high stress (working on my dissertation for instance) I was running 8 miles every other day, now I’m down to 3 miles 3 or 4 times a week, but that’s changing once again. Running for me is my main antidode to feeling sad/depressed or stressed. It’s hard not to feel better after a run. Esmail — 32N 83W                                      http://www.cs.mercer.edu/bonak

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I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life. Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for depression/anxiety.?

I can’t speak about depression but I did run for stress control and it was VERY effective. I was always a morning runner and go to work feeling very calm and the usual anxiety driven demands seemed less daunting. I could not begin to guess how much it would help general depression but I’ll bet it does little harm. — Caveat Lector "the further you go outside, the further you go inside" – B. McKibben Doug Freese

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I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life. Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for depression/anxiety.? Thanks, Mike

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You just have to look at an injured runner, you will see mood change and the feeling that something is missing. Even if croos-training is involve+ADs- it is not the same high as only running can provide. When you have been a runner for 20 years, this habit of mood elevation is a must. Dan Mike a +AOk-crit dans le message … +AD4-I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am +AD4-hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. +AD4-Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life. +AD4- +AD4-Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for +AD4-depression/anxiety.? +AD4-Thanks, +AD4- +AD4-Mike

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I’ve been a runner since 1978.  I recall vaguely a study, probably 15 to 20 years ago, in which a group of patients with depression etc were separated into 2 groups.  One group received traditional psychiatric therapy, the other group was put on a running program.  At the conclusion of the test each group was evaluated for progress.  The evaluator could detect no significant differences between the groups.  The running group improved at the same rate as the therapy group. I’m not surprised.  I believe strongly that running helped me to maintain my sanity during a divorce.  It’s hard to feel bad after a good run. Michael

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You just have to look at an injured runner, you will see mood change and the feeling that something is missing. Even if croos-training is involve+ADs- it is not the same high as only running can provide. When you have been a runner for 20 years, this habit of mood elevation is a must. Dan Mike a +AOk-crit dans le message … +AD4-I find that running is very helpful for depression/anxiety and am +AD4-hoping that I can eventually substitute running for medication. +AD4-Generally I feel hardier, energetic, and more excited about life. +AD4- +AD4-Does anyone have experience or generally thoughts about running for +AD4-depression/anxiety.? +AD4-Thanks, +AD4- +AD4-Mike

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