Question:

Anti- anxiety drugs tend to have nasty side effects or to be addictive, so it might be worth investigating alternative ways of dealing with anxiety first. Knowing that anxiety comes from a hormone, rather than a real-life situation that has to be dealt with is one step forward.  Other techniques that many people find useful are those based on deep belly breathing. Yoga and meditation classes help with others–though you want to avoid cultlike meditation groups, which, alas, abound.  Insight Meditation groups (Vipassana) are often very helpful if you have on in your area. A short term aid if you find your pulse racing, is to splash cold water on your face for a few moments. This activates your dive reflex, and rather surprisingly, works. — http://server3.ezboard.com/blowcarbfordiabetes Low Carb for Diabetes Message Board

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Hi group, I am taking Glucophage and Birth control pills to help treat my diabetes type II, the birth control are to help with my hormones becuase I have PCOS as well (insulin resistant).  I notice on my "placebo" week, I get mild to moderate anxiety….I was just wondering if any of the women know if a female hormonal imbalance can cause anxiety, I notice when I am back on the pills, I don’t have anxiety… Also, does anyone know if taking the herb Kava Kave and/or St. Johns Wart to help with anxiety is safe if I am taking Glucophage as well?  I take 1/2 a glucophage a day. Thanks everyone! ~Susan Type II,  22 years old

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Susan, Does your own testosterone level rise during the off week? I know that PCOS is a disorder where women have higher than normal testosterone. I am now exploring HRT and have found that some Estrogen/Testosterone supplements cause me to experience intense anxiety for about 6 hrs after they come on (coupled with increased blood pressure) while others do not.   –Jenny The Low Carb for Diabetes Bulletin Board http://server3.ezboard.com/blowcarbfordiabetes

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Hi Jenny, actually, I do have elevated testoterone levels, which is the what BCP are for…..I wonder if my endo has the ability to prescribe a mild anti-anxiety prescrition without having to go to a $200/hour pychiatrist. ~Susan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Susan, Does your own testosterone level rise during the off week? I know that PCOS is a disorder where women have higher than normal testosterone. I am now exploring HRT and have found that some Estrogen/Testosterone supplements cause me to experience intense anxiety for about 6 hrs after they come on (coupled with increased blood pressure) while others do not. –Jenny The Low Carb for Diabetes Bulletin Board http://server3.ezboard.com/blowcarbfordiabetes

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Question:

About 2 years ago I started having C. About a month later I had a panic attack. I thought I was going to die so I went to the hospital. They did all the blood work,ekg, x-rays. They told me it was probably caused by gas. Well After weeks of these panic attacks I went to s doctor and he told me that I had a spastic colon/IBS. I have tried all the medication for spastic colon and it seems to work a little. But I have terrible pain on both sides of my groin and near my sternum. I have now tring the caltrate plus to see if that works. Does anyone else have the panic attacks with their IBS?  Please contact me if you have ANY information. plis…@mindspring.com THANKS!

Response:

Hi! Yes, there seems to be huge mind/body link with this condition. Most of us can report that our IBS was triggered by some event(could be physical or emotional/psychological) in our lives. One of the worst things(for me, at least) is the whole chicken/egg syndrome of "do I have IBS because of stress or is my IBS giving me more stress, etc.,etc". The most important thing is to eliminate the possibility of more serious conditions, and then, try to cope with the IBS. From what I can tell from reading this group, what works is HIGHLY individual, as in, what work for some, or maybe even quite a few folks, won’t necessarily work for you. Some suggestions that may work, (but try them & if they don’t try something else, until you find what works for you), can include an elimination diet, to see if your symptoms are linked to certain foods; stress relief/deep breathing/yoga type relaxation methods; or possibly even anti-anxiety or anti-depressant medication. I have the C type of IBS, too. Sometimes, I think that the pain and tension builds up from the whole feeling of being blocked up/full. Regular fibre has worked for me(if only I would take it regularly ), try various things and try to include your doctor (if you have a good one). Good Luck to you, Pamela Kendall Gary Phillips <plis…@mindspring.com

wrote in message

news:7foqjb$7rk$1@nntp4.atl.mindspring.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

About 2 years ago I started having C. About a month later I had a panic attack. I thought I was going to die so I went to the hospital. They did all the blood work,ekg, x-rays. They told me it was probably caused by gas. Well After weeks of these panic attacks I went to s doctor and he told me that I had a spastic colon/IBS. I have tried all the medication for spastic colon and it seems to work a little. But I have terrible pain on both sides of my groin and near my sternum. I have now tring the caltrate plus to see if that works. Does anyone else have the panic attacks with their IBS?  Please contact me if you have ANY information. plis…@mindspring.com THANKS!

Response:

On 23 Apr 1999 03:48:59 GMT, plis…@mindspring.com (Gary Phillips) wrote:

About 2 years ago I started having C. About a month later I had a panic attack.

From: http://www.panix.com/~donwiss/hoggan/panic.txt Some cases of panic attacks have long been associated with abnormal levels of certain neurotransmitters, including serotonin. A recent report of drug therapies for panic disorders has suggested that modulation of serotonin levels can alter panic the propensity and intensity of such attacks(1). Further, a selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor, paroxetine, has been shown to be quite effective in alleviating this condition.   Of equal interest, perhaps, is the reported reduction in platelet receptors for serotonin, and hence a reduced capacity for transport of serotonin in the bloodstream, in celiac disease (3). The disturbances in behaviour and mood, which have long been recognized in celiac disease, have been postulated as a possible consequence of the altered serotonin metabolism which is often found in celiac disease (4,5). A connection between gluten and panic attacks seems a very reasonable possibility. I hope this is helpful. best wishes, Ron Hoggan 1. Blanchard DC, Griebel G, Rodgers RJ, Blanchard RJBenzodiazepine and sterotonergic modulation of antipredator and conspecific defense. Neurosci Biobehav Rev 1998 Sep;22(5):597-612 0 2.  Dunner D, Kumar R  Paroxetine: a review of clinical experience. Pharmacopsychiatry 1998 May;31(3):89-101 3. Chiaravalloti G, Marazziti D, Batistini A, Favilli T, Ughi C, Ceccarelli M, Cassano GB Platelet serotonin transporter in coeliac disease.  Acta Paediatr 1997 Jul;86(7):696-699 4. Hernanz A, Polanco I Plasma precursor amino acids of central nervous system monoamines in children with coeliac disease.    Gut 1991 Dec;32(12):1478-1481 5. Challacombe DN, Wheeler EE   Are the changes of mood in children with coeliac disease due to abnormal serotonin metabolism? Nutr Health 1987;5(3-4):145-152 ————————————————————————— – Other Formats:   Links:   Pharmacopsychiatry 1998 May;31(3):89-101 Paroxetine: a review of clinical experience. Dunner D, Kumar R University of Washington Medical Center, Department of Psychiatry, Seattle 98105, USA. The selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor paroxetine has been extensively studied and is now an established therapy for the treatment of depressive disorders. Paroxetine has demonstrated efficacy in major depression in both young and elderly patients, with an improved tolerability profile over conventional antidepressants. Paroxetine is effective across a continuum of anxiety and depressive disorders, including severe depression, depression with anxiety, comorbid depression and obsessive-compulsive disorder. The first agent of its class licensed for use in panic disorder, paroxetine has been shown to be effective in reducing the number of panic attacks and preventing relapse. A worldwide clinical database has established that paroxetine has a benign adverse event profile. Paroxetine therefore offers an effective and well tolerated treatment for a broad spectrum of psychiatric disorders. Acta Paediatr 1997 Jul;86(7):696-699 Platelet serotonin transporter in coeliac disease. Chiaravalloti G, Marazziti D, Batistini A, Favilli T, Ughi C, Ceccarelli M, Cassano GB Institute of Paediatrics, University of Pisa, Italy. We investigated a peripheral serotonergic marker, i.e. platelet tritiated imipramine (3H-IMI) binding sites, which are part of the 5-HT transporter complex similar to that present in the brain, in 20 patients affected by coeliac disease (CD), as compared with 20 healthy controls. Platelet membranes and 3H-IMI binding were carried out according to a standardized protocol. The results showed that coeliac patients had significantly lower 3H-IMI binding sites than controls. This finding would suggest the presence of a dysfunction at the level of the 5-HT transporter that might underline the psychic disturbances frequently observed in coeliac patients. Gut 1991 Dec;32(12):1478-1481 Plasma precursor amino acids of central nervous system monoamines in children with coeliac disease. Hernanz A, Polanco I Servicio de Bioquimica, Hospital La Paz, Madrid, Spain. Some children with coeliac disease show behavioural disorders such as depression and other signs which have been correlated with reduced central monoamine metabolism. We have therefore investigated the brain availability of the monoamine precursors tryptophan and tyrosine in 15 untreated children with coeliac disease and 12 treated children with coeliac disease as well as in 12 control children. Significantly decreased plasma concentrations of tryptophan were found in untreated children (mean (SD) 13 (4) mumols/l, p less than 0.001) compared with treated children (31 (13) mumols/l), and in both groups of coeliac children when compared with control children (81 (22) mumols/l). A significantly lower ratio of plasma tryptophan to large neutral amino acids (tyrosine, valine, isoleucine, leucine, and phenylalanine) was also observed, which could indicate impaired brain availability of tryptophan in coeliac children and was more pronounced in untreated children. The impaired availability of tryptophan could produce decreased central serotonin synthesis and in turn behaviour disorders in children with coeliac disease. Nutr Health 1987;5(3-4):145-152 Are the changes of mood in children with coeliac disease due to abnormal serotonin metabolism? Challacombe DN, Wheeler EE Somerset Children’s Research Unit, Musgrove Park Hospital, Taunton, Somerset. Children with untreated coeliac disease are characteristically unhappy and after a few days of treatment with a gluten-free diet their mood improves. This improvement in mood can be rapidly reversed by introducing gluten into their diet again which suggests that a humoral agent could be involved in this process. As serotonin is a neurotransmitter in the brain and abnormalities of serotonin metabolism have been reported in coeliac disease, this biogenic amine could be the humoral agent that mediates the changes of mood in coeliac disease. In this review the relationship between the mood changes in coeliac disease and serotonin metabolism will be further examined.

Response:

On Fri, 23 Apr 1999 11:34:08 GMT, "PamK" <p…@altavista.net

wrote: Yes, there seems to be huge mind/body link with this condition. Most of us can report that our IBS was triggered by some event(could be physical or emotional/psychological) in our lives.

Just like the triggers for celiac disease, a.k.a. gluten intolerance. Dr. Joseph Murray, of the University of Iowa, is a gastroenterologist that specializes in treating Celiac disease.  He gave a talk entitled "Celiacs in the 90s" at a conference hosted by the American Celiac Society on June 10-11, 1994.  What follows are highlights of Dr. Murray’s talk. [snip...] Dr. Murray believes there are several "triggers" that can activate Celiac disease in genetically susceptible people:   *  A sudden change to a low fat diet, which usually means a sudden      increase in starches, which usually means a dramatic increase in      wheat-based products.   *  A woman is susceptible during postpartum, when the immune system      is adjusting to the changes after delivery.   *  Surgery, particularly GI (gall bladder, etc.) can be a trigger.   *  Certain viral infections. Also, there is some suspicion that      certain antibiotics can be triggers, though in these cases it      could also be the infection that the antibiotics are fighting.

One of the worst things(for me, at least) is the whole chicken/egg syndrome of "do I have IBS because of stress or is my IBS giving me more stress, etc.,etc".

In a survey of 600 celiacs the third most common diagnosis prior to a celiac diagnosis was "Psychological stress, nerves, imagination". In a Canadian survey of 1300 celiacs 44% said they had a diagnosis of stress prior to their celiac diagnosis. This was the second most common prior diagnosis. Anemia was first in both surveys, and IBS was second in the 600 celiac survey. Third in the Canadian one was nervous condition, and IBS was fourth.

The most important thing is to eliminate the possibility of more serious conditions,

Absolutely. That is why testing for celiac disease should be done on all IBS patients. Problem is there is no money in a celiac diagnosis, so little is taught about it. Most doctors in North America barely know what it is, despite having an incidence of 1:300 or greater. For testing a biopsy of the small intestine should be done. The serum tests aren’t very accurate. A comparisons of the various labs doing the test found they ranged from 55-95% accurate. That means that at one lab 45% of the patients were given false negative results. For more on celiac disease see this annotated page of links:   The Gluten-Free Page:  http://www.GFlinks.com/ Don (donwiss at panix com).

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Question:

Hi, I’m new here. I had my first panic attack last night, gosh was it , well you know what it was like. I have Mital Valve Prolapes, it has gotten worse over the past year and last night it was acting up ,I thought maybe I was going to have a heart attack as the pain and fluttering was the worst it has ever been. Then out of nowhere I started freaking out, trembling, sweating,  a feeling doom, fear, like Ive never felt before, difficulty breathing, ect. Anyway, I called my doctor and told her what happened, she said I had a panic attack and that its not an uncomman thing in people who have MVP to experience . Is this true, does anyone else here have MVP and have they experienced panic attacks along with the syptoms of MVP?Thank you for listening. BG

BG, I have Panic Disorder and no signs of MVP. My brother, father, and sister also have had it in the past; my sister does have MVP. I noted a question from another response about PTSD, and yes, I’ve been diagnosed as such. Regards, MJ

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Hello i am new and am respomding to JGarnier. re MVP and panic attacks.  i have them exactly as you described.  my heart pounds so hard its frightening and the trembling  and racing thoughts.  i take prozac,zanax.soma.  also  try to meditate and pray. anyone with any  help?  i  have been  diagnosed with PTSD. anyone else have this?

Response:

Hi, I’m new here. I had my first panic attack last night, gosh was it , well you know what it was like. I have Mital Valve Prolapes, it has gotten worse over the past year and last night it was acting up ,I thought maybe I was going to have a heart attack as the pain and fluttering was the worst it has ever been. Then out of nowhere I started freaking out, trembling, sweating,  a feeling doom, fear, like Ive never felt before, difficulty breathing, ect. Anyway, I called my doctor and told her what happened, she said I had a panic attack and that its not an uncomman thing in people who have MVP to experience . Is this true, does anyone else here have MVP and have they experienced panic attacks along with the syptoms of MVP?Thank you for listening. BG

Response:

Hi, I’m new here. I had my first panic attack last night, gosh was it , well you know what it was like. I have Mital Valve Prolapes, it has gotten worse over the past year and last night it was acting up ,I thought maybe I was going to have a heart attack as the pain and fluttering was the worst it has ever been. Then out of nowhere I started freaking out, trembling, sweating,  a feeling doom, fear, like Ive never felt before, difficulty breathing, ect. Anyway, I called my doctor and told her what happened, she said I had a panic attack and that its not an uncomman thing in people who have MVP to experience . Is this true, does anyone else here have MVP and have they experienced panic attacks along with the syptoms of MVP?Thank you for listening. BG

Hi BG, MVP is very common in people who have panic disorder. No one is quite sure why, but researchers are beginning to think the anxiety actually causes the MVP and not the other way around…like they used to think. This all rather new research, so at this point it certainly is not a sure thing. Anyway, I have MVP and have been through all the flutters and chest pains and tightness and thinking I was having a heart attack many, many, many times. The best thing you can do, IMO, is see a cardiologist and have an echo-cardiogram ( a non-invasive procedure). This will tell you exactly how severe your MVP actually is. Usually, they are extremely benign. Some of the things that I have found that help my MVP symptoms are the following: (YMMV) 1) Quit all caffeine, alcohol and nicotine. Al of these thing make the palpitations worse in most people. 2) Exercise. Helps most folks. 3) Drink plenty of water. Reduced fluid voluumes can casue worse palpitations. 4) Eat a healthy diet. 5) Learn a relaxation technique. Especially something that involves belly breathing. Yoga would do this and you can learn it from a book. 6) Consider taking a low dose of time-release Inderal. It really helped me when my MVP was acting up. 7) Benzos like Xanax can also help. Also, most people who have an MVP are told they must take antibiotics before any dental work. There is new research out on the web at : http://www.ada.org/adapco/jada/9708/endo-02.html (ANYONE with MVP should check out this site! ) It details the degrees of MVP and who really needs the antibios and those who don’t. To me, this is one of the very best reasons for getting an echo-cardiogram. You may not be at risk and need to take antibios everytime you go to the dentist. Hope This Helps! Jen

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Question:

Hi Steve and Shani, I managed a relatively healthy pregnancy on Tegretol as a mood stabilizer, which was also okay for breast-feeding.  Not ideal, but the risk of me getting ill to the baby and self warrented staying on medication.  A trial period before conception off the Tegretol soon found me going hypomanic. Best of luck with having as healthy a pregnancy as possible. Wendy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Here is a brief history.  Fifteen years of depression, ten years of medications, and five diagnosis, I finally found someone who helped me. I was put on lithium  and serzone (anti-depressant) for bi-polar II. For once in my life I guess I felt normal.  What ever that means. All I know is I didn’t want to kill myself.  Now, I am 17 weeks pregnant and have been off medication that long.  I did well in the beginning, but one week ago today I had a suicide thought, actually a plan.  Four days later the nigtmares started again.  Another bad night.  Bad bad thoughts.  Today, has been the worst.  I got mad over sugar on the floor.  I started screaming and crying.  I went to the bathroom and starting chant outloud, "I hate myself," over and over again.  The doctor’s don’t want me on meds until at least the third tri-mester.  Who has any advice?  I am losing it quick.  Please don’t just tell me to tell my shrink.  They usually have no first hand knowledge and text book theories don’t work for me.  The sad things is I know when I switch, but I can’t stop it.  Thanks. Shani and Steve

– Ms. Wendy Holmes          

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Steve and Shani: I empathize with you though I do not have children. You are living my worst nightmare. This is the reason that I probably will never have the chance to carry the children that I so dearly want. I cried when I read your post. Everyone, including your doctor(s), can give you advice and ideas to try but one thing holds true… they are not you. Only you can find the strength and the stability that you need. Be your own best friend; your own advocate. You have gotten this far….17 weeks without medication is a long time. I applaud you! I wish that I had the opportunity to be in your shoes…bad thoughts, bad times, and all. You have the world before you… you have Steve and you have your child…but most important, you have yourself. Treat yourself like the princess that you are. Be strong and be brave. Reba Here is a brief history.  Fifteen years of depression, ten years of medications, and five diagnosis, I finally found someone who helped me. I was put on lithium  and serzone (anti-depressant) for bi-polar II. For once in my life I guess I felt normal.  What ever that means. All I know is I didn’t want to kill myself.  Now, I am 17 weeks pregnant and have been off medication that long.  I did well in the beginning, but one week ago today I had a suicide thought, actually a plan.  Four days later the nigtmares started again.  Another bad night.  Bad bad thoughts.  Today, has been the worst.  I got mad over sugar on the floor.  I started screaming and crying.  I went to the bathroom and starting chant outloud, "I hate myself," over and over again.  The doctor’s don’t want me on meds until at least the third tri-mester.  Who has any advice?  I am losing it quick.  Please don’t just tell me to tell my shrink.  They usually have no first hand knowledge and text book theories don’t work for me.  The sad things is I know when I switch, but I can’t stop it.  Thanks. Shani and Steve

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Here is a brief history.  Fifteen years of depression, ten years of medications, and five diagnosis, I finally found someone who helped me. I was put on lithium  and serzone (anti-depressant) for bi-polar II. For once in my life I guess I felt normal.  What ever that means. All I know is I didn’t want to kill myself.  Now, I am 17 weeks pregnant and have been off medication that long.  I did well in the beginning, but one week ago today I had a suicide thought, actually a plan.  Four days later the nigtmares started again.  Another bad night.  Bad bad thoughts.  Today, has been the worst.  I got mad over sugar on the floor.  I started screaming and crying.  I went to the bathroom and starting chant outloud, "I hate myself," over and over again.  The doctor’s don’t want me on meds until at least the third tri-mester.  Who has any advice?  I am losing it quick.  Please don’t just tell me to tell my shrink.  They usually have no first hand knowledge and text book theories don’t work for me.  The sad things is I know when I switch, but I can’t stop it.  Thanks. Shani and Steve

Hi – I have no personal experience in this since I wasn’t dx’d until after my second child was born.  I furthermore had complete remissions during (due to?) my pregnancy.  IMO if you really think that you might even possibly hurt yourself, that kills the baby no matter what.  With medications, in a perfect world you should not be on any neds, but the risks seem quite small compared to the risk of an untreated BP commiting suicide (20%).  Here are some articles I pulled up using the Exite search engine with key words "lithium pregnancy" and "serzone prgnancy" (sorry I didn’t cite the sources in each case – no infingment of copyright was intended).  I’d say go back on the drugs, at the lowest dose possible.  But I am not a medical professional, so it is really up to you.  The web has a lot of studies on this.  Good luck. Kimberly (who seems to be feretting out scientific info today)     Jacobson and colleagues prospectively studied 148 pregnant women who took lithium during the first trimester and had contacted a teratogen information center. For comparison, the researchers followed 148 pregnant controls, matched for age, who had sought counseling about other drugs that are not considered teratogenic. Three infants in each group were born with major congenital malformations. An additional fetus in the lithium group had Ebstein’s anomaly detected by fetal echocardiography; this pregnancy was terminated. The two groups had similar numbers of miscarriages and premature births.     The authors conclude that lithium "is not an important human teratogen." However, they acknowledge that their limited sample size cannot exclude a small but real teratogenic effect. –ASB. Fro Dr. Ivan’s Page: What recommendations could be made to a recently married young woman who is currently stablized on LiCO3 and desires to become pregnant, especially with regard to risks vs. benefits of any treatment modality during pregnancy?      The best way to control of bipolar disorder during pregnancy depends on a number of factors. Most important      are the history of prior episodes, and the past results of discontinuing lithium. For many women, prengancy is a      time of improved mental functioning, while the post-partum period is often a time when depression may be a      problem.      If a woman’s history includes relatively few mood episodes that have been separated by long periods of euthymia,      the VERY gradual discointinuation of lithium (over a couple of months) might precede attempts to become      pregnancy. If prior attempts to gradually discontinue lithium have resuled in the rapid onset of a depressive or      manic episode, discontinuation prior to trying to get pregnant does not make sense.      At one time it was thought that lithium was extremely toxic to the developing fetus, and that approximately 1% of      babies exposed to lithium in-utero would develop severe, possibly lethal, heart defects. More recent research has      determined that the risk of such defects is actually one-tenth of a percent rather than the 1% previously estimated.      As the anti- convulsant drugs used as lithium alternatives can also cause severe congenital abnormalities, they      cannot be considered as alternatives to lithium duing pregnancy. Four of my patients have delivered five healthy      babies after taking lithium though- out their pregnancies. Ref: Sachs GS & Cohen LS Update on pharmacologic treatment of mood disorders: Bipoolar disorder and management through preg- nancy and postpartum. Psychiat Clin N Amer 1995, 2, 21-75. In terms of risks during pregnancy, remember that recurrent depression is also a risk, both to mother and fetus. The risk of the medication (in terms or birth defects) is mostly within the first three months; many patients with recurrent depression who become pregnant can safely take their medication after the first trimester. Some patients who are at high risk for severe, suicidal depression should consider maintaining antidepressants throughout the pregnancy, in my opinion. Thus, it would be important to discuss the risk/benefit ratio of the Serzone very carefully with your doctor.

Response:

Here is a brief history.  Fifteen years of depression, ten years of medications, and five diagnosis, I finally found someone who helped me. I was put on lithium  and serzone (anti-depressant) for bi-polar II. For once in my life I guess I felt normal.  What ever that means. All I know is I didn’t want to kill myself.  Now, I am 17 weeks pregnant and have been off medication that long.  I did well in the beginning, but one week ago today I had a suicide thought, actually a plan.  Four days later the nigtmares started again.  Another bad night.  Bad bad thoughts.  Today, has been the worst.  I got mad over sugar on the floor.  I started screaming and crying.  I went to the bathroom and starting chant outloud, "I hate myself," over and over again.  The doctor’s don’t want me on meds until at least the third tri-mester.  Who has any advice?  I am losing it quick.  Please don’t just tell me to tell my shrink.  They usually have no first hand knowledge and text book theories don’t work for me.  The sad things is I know when I switch, but I can’t stop it.  Thanks. Shani and Steve

Response:

x-archive-no: yes <<Now, I am 17 weeks pregnant and have been off medication that long.  I did well in the beginning, but one week ago today I had a suicide thought, actually a plan.  Four days later the nigtmares started again.  Another bad night.  Bad bad thoughts.  Today, has been the worst.  I got mad over sugar on the floor.  I started screaming and crying.  I went to the bathroom and starting chant outloud, "I hate myself," over and over again.  The doctor’s don’t want me on meds until at least the third tri-mester.  Who has any advice?  I am losing it quick.  Please don’t just tell me to tell my shrink.  They usually have no first hand knowledge and text book theories don’t work for me.  The sad things is I know when I switch, but I can’t stop it.  Thanks. Shani, Steve… this sounds like it’s pretty tough, and it isn’t going to get easier for a while. My advice is to have someone there for you that you trust, when you are starting to feel like you are losing it. Have a list of friends, or if Steve is home all the time – he can help. Try and work out a plan of how you will handle one of these situations – and have that trusted person there to help you follow through. Deep breathing, yoga (there is a great tape for yoga during pregnancy – if you’re interested let me know), talk to a midwife if you can find one in your area. A midwife might have some very fine and very wise and experienced advice for you on how to get through this. Another thing I’d like to add, and this is not to get you worried… but whenever you go through these difficult times, you are sending something called catacholines through your system… this reaches the baby, and can have a negative affect. I don’t know exactly in what way, but I think it is minimal. Please ask the midwife about this, if you decide to contact one. All I am trying to say by warning you of this is that you need to find ways to keep yourself calm, because your emotions affect your child too. I went through a lot of fear and hypomania in my last pregnancy, and I don’t know if it affected my daughter, but she is very intense, cries a lot, and has always been that way. I think that if I had developed better coping techniques during my pregnancy, perhaps she would be a calmer child. But who knows. She is who she is, and I love her in every way. I wish you the best of luck… enjoy your pregnancy, it is an awesome and incredible miracle to have a child inside of you… you have an opportunity to experience this in a way that will bond all of you together from even before the child is born. Remember the miracle part – all you have to do is take a deep breath and put your hands to your stomach. And again, set up a plan. You need to have some people and some methods of coping ready for whenever you need them. ~amaris~

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Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A friend of mine is in the hospital right now, suffering from bipolar disorder. She doesn’t want to take drugs and I’m trying to find out for her what alternatives there are. Any herbal or other natural treatments out there? Thanks. Lisa Dear Lisa,   Of course everyone is different I am just saying what I do. I take 100ml of the antidepressant zoloft a day. It takes the edge off the mood swings…less irratable…less racing thoughts..less crying and raging…etc. it is good to have something that gives you a basis of stability…(that is what zoloft does for me) evens the playing field.    I believe because of this….I can remain off other drugs…. 1. you have to trust yourself….which is hard….but it is key 2. you have to listen to your body and mind….CLOSELY what are you thinking…what are you feeling…what does it mean 3. you have to know what are your triggers for mania and depression: stress, too much to do, noise, lack of sleep 4 you have to find alternatives to move you out of either extreme breathing….yoga….music….food….affirmations….staying in the now There are a lot of people who would rather not be so self obervant but if you want to try to live drug free with this disorder….this is what I had to do…. if you want more details….email me…. Christine Wrdmystris Recreate Yourself To Thine Ownself Be True

Dear Lisa, I can offer the names of a few books on holistic remedies. "Healing Depression" by Catherine Carrigan is an extensive exploration of holistic approaches to bipolar illness by someone who has been through it. "Miracles Do Happen" by C. Norman Shealy M.D. has a large chapter on his successes healing depressed patients using holistic approaches. "Anatomy of the Spirit" by Caroline Myss describes a more metaphysical approach to healing by a highly regarded medical intuitive and includes case examples of people with depression. In my opinion, self-awareness is the key to finding the right healing approach. I have an ongoing internal debate about holistic vs. pharmaceutical treatment for myself. For physical health I’ve found that pharmaceutical medicine has worked best for me for acute problems and that holistic approaches feel right for non-acute chronic problems. One of the things that has helped me the most with emotional problems is having people around who are supportive and non-judgemental. Thanks for supporting your friend in the ways she wants. Peace and Love, Moonear

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Lisa, I am sorry your friend is in the hospital.  She must be quite ill, and meds would probably be of great value to her. Lithium carbonate is a naturally occurring salt.  It is present in the soil and in water (mineral springs). Nature gave us the earth with so many useful minerals. I don’t consider lithium a drug. (Although even it I did think of it as drug, I would still take it, because it works.) Hope your friend get stable and happy. Smooth sailing, Cathy

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This a popular topic among new people in particular, unfortunately I think.  New bipolars, my self included are generally in denial that they have a lifelong, debilitating disease.  A disease the requires medication and therapy, and in my opinion cannot be treated w/ herbs alon

In the deepest part of my mania I listened to a voice I thought was god. The voice told me that time was at a stand still and human history couldn’t continue until I did this or that….and I did it…at no point I said no….luckily it was dumb stuff like scraping black stuff off my microwave and putting bleach in dark clothes.   But when I think back….if that voice would have said "kill your son….or murder your daughter….or cut your own throat…" I WOULD HAVE DONE IT. Needless to say this scares the shit out of me and I do what ever I can to prevent a manic relapse…(two years knock wood)      When I started taking my zoloft…I didn’t want it….I didn’t like the idea of "being drugged up" even though i was calmer and able to sleep (i have had sleep disturbances since i was 4….sleep walking sleep talking, night terrors, hallucianations.) the zoloft let me sleep without this for the first time in my life…. but still I didn’t want to be thought of as "the crazy person on drugs" So I stopped taking my zoloft. Because I thought I was just stressed out and thus hospitalized….I didn’t have MD. At first I couldn’t sleep, then I became senstive to noise…then agitated…then I was screaming at my kids….throwing plates and chasing them with a broom.  In 4 days I was out of control….finally my daughter said "mom     I have taken them plus the other stradegies I use to relieve stress and uncomplicate my life….because I love my children and I don’t want to hurt them….or kill them…. And I love myself and think it would be nice to stick around here for a long while.     If the "practical things I do…stopped working….I would be the first one knocking at my pdoc door…..and saying…"lets talk medicine" Christine Wrdmystris Recreate Yourself To Thine Ownself Be True

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Hi, just some food for thought. I take 50mg of Zoloft which helps a great deal. After being diagnosed, but before Zoloft (4 months) I started to take l-tyrosine, an amino acid.  That and watching diet,stress and exercise helped significantly– I felt happier and more balanced than in years.  Needless to say, after having a bad anxiety episode followed by feeling rotten and weepy, I told my doc that i wanted to try drug therapy.  The combination of the Z. and the tyrosine, plus really trying to minimize self-imposed chaos is helping me through. With good wishes, Holly

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Hi, just some food for thought. I take 50mg of Zoloft which helps a great deal. After being diagnosed, but before Zoloft (4 months) I started to take l-tyrosine, an amino acid.  That and watching diet,stress and exercise helped significantly– I felt happier and more balanced than in years.  Needless to say, after having a bad anxiety episode followed by feeling rotten and weepy, I told my doc that i wanted to try drug therapy.  The combination of the Z. and the tyrosine, plus really trying to minimize self-imposed chaos is helping me through. With good wishes, Holly

Hi, I am wondering if you, or anyone else reading this has tried an SSRI without the tyrosine and then with it, to find out if the antidepressant works better with the tyrosine. Just wondering, –Carroll

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A friend of mine is in the hospital right now, suffering from bipolar disorder. She doesn’t want to take drugs and I’m trying to find out for her what alternatives there are. Any herbal or other natural treatments out there? Thanks. Lisa

Response:

A friend of mine is in the hospital right now, suffering from bipolar disorder. She doesn’t want to take drugs and I’m trying to find out for her what alternatives there are. Any herbal or other natural treatments out there? Thanks. Lisa

Dear Lisa,   Of course everyone is different I am just saying what I do. I take 100ml of the antidepressant zoloft a day. It takes the edge off the mood swings…less irratable…less racing thoughts..less crying and raging…etc. it is good to have something that gives you a basis of stability…(that is what zoloft does for me) evens the playing field.    I believe because of this….I can remain off other drugs…. 1. you have to trust yourself….which is hard….but it is key 2. you have to listen to your body and mind….CLOSELY what are you thinking…what are you feeling…what does it mean 3. you have to know what are your triggers for mania and depression: stress, too much to do, noise, lack of sleep 4 you have to find alternatives to move you out of either extreme breathing….yoga….music….food….affirmations….staying in the now There are a lot of people who would rather not be so self obervant but if you want to try to live drug free with this disorder….this is what I had to do…. if you want more details….email me…. Christine Wrdmystris Recreate Yourself To Thine Ownself Be True

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x-archive-no: yes i felt this way at the beginning… wasted a lot of time trying to get stabilized on SJW, when it was the wrong thing for me altogether. i finally gave in and am taking the drugs. finally starting to feel some relief. but, i hope to eventuallly incorporate a lot of the things that Wrdmystris mentions into my life… and maybe, just maybe, i will be able to live without the drugs. i don’t know. what i read here at the NG is that it is generally discouraged. but i am not opposed to alternatives, and hearing from folks that are using them. thing is, we have to be vigilant in discussing these things… there are many people (maybe myself included) that cannot live without the medications… it is a life or death issue. perhaps, since your friend is in the hospital, this is the case with her as well. my recommendation? for what it’s worth… get stabilized on some medication. this comes from someone who had a planned home birth, who hasn’t taken more than an occasional tylenol for many, many years, who has homeopathic remedies, teas and all sorts of herbal remedies at home. i use them all the time for the kids and myself, they are very effective. but i found *none of them* to be effective in the treatment of bipolar, for myself. my naturopath recommended lithium. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A friend of mine is in the hospital right now, suffering from bipolar disorder. She doesn’t want to take drugs and I’m trying to find out for her what alternatives there are. Any herbal or other natural treatments out there? Thanks. Lisa

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Question:

I am a personal fitness trainer and am interested in learning more about yoga. Taking a class is not an option right now, but looking at some good books on the subject is what I would like to start with. I know there are different kinds of yoga; I would like to start with something very basic, for general good health, flexibility, increase focus and to relieve stress. It would be helpful if the books were illustrated with the exercises. Any suggestions? Thanks. Dolores

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I am a personal fitness trainer and am interested in learning more about yoga. Taking a class is not an option right now, but looking at some good books on the subject is what I would like to start with. I know there are different kinds of yoga; I would like to start with something very basic, for general good health, flexibility, increase focus and to relieve stress. It would be helpful if the books were illustrated with the exercises. Any suggestions? Thanks. Dolores

Try: The Complete Yoga Book, 3 volumes in one, Yoga of Breathing, Yoga of Posture, Yoga of Meditation, with 230 illustrations, by Jame Hewitt, Schocken Books, New-York. Originally published in Great Britain, 1977. Random House , Inc. 1989, ISBN 0-8052-0969-7

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Question:

Hi all. We saw our RE after a 5-month break from treatment, and she said because my ovaries are not responding well for their age, (it’s like I’m in my early 40’s, and I’m almost 34) combined with DH low sperm, she isn’t hopeful about IVF, and says ICSI is the only way to go. I’ve taken Gonal F before so that won’t be new, but egg retrieval, what’s that like? How long is the wait to see how many fertilize? I’m obviously going to a class to learn more, but I’d like to hear from anyone out there. If ICSI failed for you, were you able to tell why, and maybe adjust the next meds or something else for the next try? The thought of getting pg is so beyond me at this point, sometimes I wish DH would just agree to adopt. But I’m compromising by trying this first. Mary

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My DH and I recently went through our first cycle of ICSI/IVF.  They removed 12 eggs and 10 were large enough to attempt fertilization.  With the ICSI process, all 10 of them fertilized.  I felt fine the day of egg retrieval except for some tenderness in my lower abdomen later in that day. We had to wait till the following morning to find out how many of the eggs fertilized. The three eggs were transferred to me two days after retrieval.  This first cycle was not a success for us.  I had what was called a chemical pregnancy where there was implantation but the embryo did not grow.  Unfortunately, there is no real explanation for why it happened.  As far as I can tell, they will not be changing any of the medication for the next transfer.  They feel their best chance is to try IVF again. You’ve got to try to have a positive attitude throughout the process.  Don’t give up hope yet!!!  There are many success stories out there.  My husband and I will be trying again in April. Good Luck, Janet

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I had 1st IVF/ICSI/AH in Dec.98, and it failed. Had FET Jan 30 with the extra embryos and praise God- I’m pregnant!! My RE couldn’t tell me why it didn’t work the first time either, just one of those things I guess.  But so far, so good.  Good luck to you. ltd

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We did IVF last May and they used ICSI.  Unfortunately, it was unsuccessful.  I wondered why my RE went to ICSI when they told us they were going to let my DH’s sperm try to fertlize on their own and then do rescue ICSI if they could not fertilize.  Instead, they went straight to ICSI.  I have heard that ICSI can compromise the embryo quality and that they cannot isolate the good sperm from the bad.  We had okay embryo quality, but not great.  It doesn’t take long after you have the retrieval.  A few days.  Then the transfer, the wait 2 weeks for PG test.   My doctor was not able to tell me why the IVF failed and I felt they were not upfront with us. But, I am thinking about doing it again as soon as we can save the money.  I want to try everything I can before we consider adoption. Good luck.  I would be glad to answer any questions. B.

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I know the request was from a woman’s point of view, but I thought I might add a couple of things.  First, my wife got the lumps from the sesame seed oil and our nurse suggested Peanut oil.  We only have about 4 weeks to go and a very light stay on the heating pad seems to have minimized the bumps this time.   Also, watch out for hyperstimulation.  This is the weight gain and swelling they tell you to watch for.  My wife has had it both times, but it just most often requires that you just Take Care of Yourself.  My wife takes solace in the fact that it is a sign of pregnancy and may even help to sustain the pregnancy. The most important thing to remember is that this is the most important thing you have to do.  The job, the housework and all the rest can go hang!  Just sit back and relax and tell you husband that you are doing the hard part, he can handle the chores.  I don’t know about your husband, but I am so darn happy, there isn’t a whole lot I won’t happily do. —

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We are going to begin our ICSI program soon. I need to have info from the womens perspective. The daily injections scare me.  What are some of the side effects. Tell me everything you can. Jennifer

Hi Jennifer, I had already done 4 cycles of Pergonal or Metrodin IUIs, so I was used to the IM shots.  The shots themselves are not so bad, it just that it goes on so long.  I think Fertinex will really be boon to everyone, because the sub-q shots are soooooo much easier.  The shots do get easier with time and practice.   I have had little in the way of side effects from any of the drugs. (Big lumps in my hips from the progesterone in peanut oil, but when I changed to progesterone in sesame oil, they went away.)   Egg retrieval is painful, but not too bad.  I was sore for the rest of the day (I think I took two Tylenol once later that day), and somewhat sore for the next day but not enough to need pain medication.  (The worst was driving over speed bumps!)   Transfer was not a problem (a tiny bit of trouble getting the catheter through my cervix and a tiny bit of cramping because of that), but it was difficult for me to lay for the 1 1/2 hours that my clinic recommends.  I just could not get comfortable.  It might help you to bring an extra pillow or something to help you get comfy.   And all in all, the waiting was not too bad.  I was on bed rest for the rest of the day of transfer and for two days after that.  This was hard.  Have lots of books handy and videos to watch.  Be aware that many women report they really lose hope about a week post egg retrieval and are really convinced it won’t work.  This has nothing whatsoever to do with the outcome of your IVF, so just roll with it and go ahead and test as planned.   I am including my draft IVF hints at the end of this post.  Hopefully they will help you cope. Best of luck to you!! Rachel Browne General Hints The main IVF hint is: pamper yourself! Figure out where and how you want to get news each day for how much meds to take, etc. and on the big days of finding out about fertilization and hopefully positive pregnancy test.  Those days can be tough if things don’t go well! You might want someone around, like your husband!  You have to get through each stage of the process! REST – REST – REST.  That is my advice to you. Try to get to know the people who are treating you so you aren’t just another pair of ovaries and a uterus. Try to make a friend or two at the clinic who is there for IVF, too.  It takes the "edge" off. Bring a book or magazine in a.m.  You might be there for awhile. Make sure they do a mock transfer prior to the actual embryo transfer. This is not fun, but it is necessary that they know the depth of your uterus so they know where to put the embryos! Do whatever it is you need to do to make this manageable for you. (Naps, backrubs, your favorite foods… Be good, very good to yourself during this time.)   Try to manage stress… (Relaxation Breathing, Yoga, Meditation, etc.). I really do think it influences hormones, etc. No caffeine or alcohol… well maybe just a little.     Buy a good fertility book.  Both Taking Charge of Your Fertility and Getting Pregnant with the New Technologies are good. They will answer a lot of questions. Ask your RE a lot of questions about your progress, what the numbers mean, etc..  Also, you should be able to get copies of anything  in your file.  For example,  I got copies of my follicle growth and E2 test results and my fertilization report (where they comment on and rate embryo quality).  I was able to compare my two cycles and talk with the RE about them.  I’ve found that the more knowledgeable you are, the more likely they are to openly share information and take time to explain. Find someone on this newsgroup who is in a similar situation (factor, cycle)  that you can email and share stories and progress with.  It can be very comforting. My first cycle I stopped drinking coffee, alcohol, and diet drinks as soon as I started the meds.  The second cycle I stopped after the retrieval.  There didn’t seem to be any effect on the stimulation or embryo quality (in fact quality was better the second time – unrelated of course and everyone’s different). Think positive! It’s been helpful to be e-mailing folk who are cycling or who have recently. Try to keep a very flexible schedule the week before the pg test.  I started my period early and was at work delivering a training to 15 people when I realized my period was coming.  Finishing out the day was torture. Shot and Medication Hints Be your own advocate for suggesting pain-free alternatives to your doctor. Instead of Lupron, I took Synarel, which is not a shot but a nasal spray. Synarel is the drug used more often in European IVF centers, including the Belgian center where ICSI was developed. I suggested Synarel to my doctor, but he likes to be able to control the dosage and Synarel only has one dosage. Instead of painful oil-based progesterone shots, I took progesterone suppositories. These have to be hand-made by your pharmacist, but they aren’t a shot, and they go exactly where you need the progesterone to go.  They are kind of messy, though. My clinic has you do both progesterone suppositories and shots.   Take measures to lessen pain when an alternative drug is not available. Before each Metrodin shot, my DH rubbed the area with Lidocaine, which is a topical anesthetic cream. After each shot, I took a warm, wonderful bubble bath. I found myself looking forward to the bath, and so it gave my mind something positive to focus on. My two favorites are icing the area beforehand (for the IM shots only of course) and lying down for the big shots and taking a few deep breaths beforehand.  I’ve had virtually no pain and little soreness using this technique. For progesterone shots I found lying down on my side with leg drawn up the best way to avoid pain or bruising from shot. Gives a more stable platform. When I had 2 shots this time standing while husband out of town (at doctor office) I got sore and a bit bruised again, thus confirming the new technique as much better!!  A heating pad was not even needed much this time. Line up who will do shots or learn how to do them yourself before you get stuck alone. We made up a daily chart of what meds each of us would take. I left a blank for amount, if they would call with how much to take. We checked off each time we took meds to make sure we didn’t forget anything. At one point I was taking 3 shots a day plus 4 pills a day, so it is best to keep track of everything ahead of time (heparin twice daily, progesterone, Medrol, doxycycline twice a day, baby aspirin, and vitamin). See… that was 5 pills. Make sure you are on medications to prevent embryo rejection (low dose corticosteroids, etc.) which will optimize your chances of success. Always read back to the nurse your directions for meds and get your E2 level.  If something seems wrong or unclear, ask for clarification. Travel Hints If you’re taking Synarnel as your suppression medication and you are travelling, be careful with exposing it to airplane cabin pressure.  I lost half a bottle in my purse even though the safety deal was on it. At $300+ a bottle is was an expensive lesson. Keep a watch on your normal time zone and take your meds according to that watch, rather than doing the math and trying to keep it straight. Finding a hotel with a small refrigerator in the room is helpful for keeping the meds at the right temp.   Positive Thinking and De-Stressing Hints Throughout the cycle, I used self-hypnosis tapes to keep my mind on warm and fuzzy thoughts. Keep social contacts to a minimum. My DH and I used the cycle as an opportunity to focus on ourselves and on one another. Try to relax and think positive. For sanity sake I would review the odds your succeeding or not ahead of time, then try to get some reality back in one’s head.  Next toss that out and go with cautious optimism till you get some bad news. Hopefully you’ll ride cautious optimism and as much neutrality as you can all the way to a baby in your arms.  I found it best to try to stay as neutral as possible (though more hopeful side of neutral along the way) to avoid major ups and downs. Egg Retrieval and Embryo Transfer Hints I needed at least the day after my retrieval off of work.  I wasn’t in a lot of pain, but I was very tired and kind of light headed. Ask for something to stem nausea during the IVF retrieval, which was IV sedation for me and I believe most places use that method now.  A drug called Phenergan is a mild sedative and also will help keep you from vomiting or having nausea from other meds. It really helped me and I highly recommend asking anesthesiologist. For me, I preferred to be asleep during procedure. You will not really be totally out, but you won’t remember afterwards if you ask to be asleep. Some places let you watch a monitor. We’ve had them take my glasses away, so it wouldn’t have been any good anyway. Have someone around to drive you back from retrieval and transfer.  Have someone to help feed you and do some chores for at least a day after transfer, so you can stay resting (probably also good after retrieval, just in case you hyperstimulate or get sore).  Heating pad on belly helped me. Day of retrieval… make sure that you tell them about any allergies. You will likely be given a narcotic pain killer afterwards.  I had a reaction and ended up vomiting for a good hour or so.  You can ask for a non-narcotic pain killer which works just as well in my experience and I am very sensitive to pain. If you have any significant pain after leaving or in the next day or two after retrieval, something may wrong… LET THEM KNOW.  I had a blood vessel nicked once and had internal bleeding and needed to go to the hospital and then be monitored closely. One thing I kept … read more »

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